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I cancelled my server and disputed the transaction because it was terminated - Page 2
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I cancelled my server and disputed the transaction because it was terminated

24

Comments

  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    @Microlinux said:
    It looks like the OP didn't read the TOS and is confused, but I'm not sure what "fraud" has been committed?

    He chargeback via paypal :P He was outside the refund period and decided to chargeback instead of living with the TOS he agreed to at the time of services rendered.

    That's fraud.

    @darkshire said:
    you are the fraudster as you have gained in this situation; until you refund him in full or prorated, you will remain so.

    I'm sorry you don't seem to understand how WHMCS works. If you submit an immediate cancellation it is automatically cancelled when the cron runs. If he did not tell me that it was a mistake or etc. How would I know. Please go look at the images I posted before continuing. You obviously haven't.

    One of those cancellations was MONTHS AGO. How is that even relevant?

    His services were not cancelled until he charged back. Once again, I don't know one provider that leaves an account active when someone charges back.

    Thanked by 1mpkossen
  • @MCHPhil said:
    He chargeback via paypal

    Ok, fair enough. But why not just re-activate the VPSes he paid for in the first place? Seems like it would have saved a lot of hassle, it sounds like he was at least open to that.

  • mike0000mike0000 Member
    edited June 2014

    MCHPhil said: He chargeback via paypal :P He was outside the refund period and decided to chargeback instead of living with the TOS he agreed to at the time of services rendered.

    >

    That's fraud.

    Technically speaking.. paying for a service, receiving that service (or part thereof), and then charging back is indeed fraud (for everyone else in this thread).

    The service was cancelled by the user.. So it should've been shutdown/cancelled, and in accordance with the TOS you agreed to, you don't get a refund.

    I think it could've been handled better by @MCHPhil as I don't believe the OP was truly attempting to commit fraud.. I just don't think he read the TOS and got upset. However the blame lies solely on OP here - read the fine print.

  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    @Microlinux said:
    Ok, fair enough. But why not just re-activate the VPSes he paid for in the first place? Seems like it would have saved a lot of hassle, it sounds like he was at least open to that.

    What I did, is standard in this industry. I know of NO providers that operate this way. Please let me know if there are some. Please don't think I'm being an asshole or etc. I'm blunt and people take it that way. As can be seen.

    @mikeyur said:
    I think it could've been handled better by MCHPhil as I don't believe the OP was truly attempting to commit fraud.. I just don't think he read the TOS and got upset. However the blame lies solely on OP here - read the fine print.

    I try to make it so it's not a read the fine print situation. Most providers do not allow a refund on service other than your first month, first product. A refund is sort of a free trial. No strings attached. Because he knew what the service level was and etc he should have not needed another free trial for subsequent purchases.

    My tos clearly states this. It's like 10-12 clauses, very small and to the point. If a provider does not have this sort of clause, I almost bet they will say it's an abuse of the refund policy. It is. But I don't care for those situation so I spell it out.

  • mikeyur said: I think it could've been handled better by @MCHPhil as I don't believe the OP was truly attempting to commit fraud.. I just don't think he read the TOS and got upset. However the blame lies solely on OP here - read the fine print.

    Am with the OP you carnt charge for a service and not deliver entirely. all phil had to do is issue a part refund. then no problem but he proceeded to steal/keep the op's money.

  • said: I got the VPS and had nothing but problems getting the internet to work. I sent in several tickets and not one was responded to. I got fed up and sent a cancellation request to get a refund.

    A server without a working network connection isn't very useful. The OP did not receive the service ordered.

    The provider could have easily avoided all of this mess by simply helping the client.

  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    @TarZZ92 said:

    Even though he is outside of my refund period and not eligible for any refund at all. I should just refund him because why?

    I delivered entirely until he submitted two cancellation requests and NEVER opened a ticket about them. And then he chargeback, committed fraud, and I'm suppose to just roll over? Thank you, I hope you brought lube?

  • MCHPhil said: Even though he is outside of my refund period and not eligible for any refund at all. I should just refund him because why?

    Well it would have prevented all this.

  • MCHPhil said: I hope you brought lube?

    Just shows more stupidity from you Phil. you need to grow up as i said. hopefully potential customers will see how silly and unprofessional you are.

  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    Silly and unprofessional I am. How? I stand up to BS? I won't be bullied by some people on the interwebs?

    You couldn't answer any question I had but resorted to name calling again :D Good job!

    Thanked by 1iKeyZ
  • Here's a genuine question, why is sales tax not applicable on your order form?

  • jcalebjcaleb Member

    My only issue is the phrasing/words used in replying to ticket. I would expect a more professional tone even when a customer is problematic.

  • petrispetris Member

    @ricardo said:
    Here's a genuine question, why is sales tax not applicable on your order form?

    It depends on the state you're based out of and what their laws and/or sales tax exemptions are.

  • @MCHPhil said:
    What I did, is standard in this industry. I know of NO providers that operate this way.

    I don't know about that. I would hope a reputable provider would reactivate your prepaid VPS shortly after you accidentally cancelled it. Things did not seem overly egregious early on.

  • petrispetris Member

    @Microlinux said:
    I don't know about that. I would hope a reputable provider would reactivate your prepaid VPS shortly after you accidentally cancelled it. Things did not seem overly egregious early on.

    This doesn't look like a case of accidental cancellation.

  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    @ricardo said:
    Here's a genuine question, why is sales tax not applicable on your order form?

    Law requires it after 1 mil in annual sales. Genuine answer :D

    @jcaleb said:
    My only issue is the phrasing/words used in replying to ticket. I would expect a more professional tone even when a customer is problematic.

    I could see that, I hoped to convey the same confused tone to him as I got from him. As you can likely tell I have really no idea what he is upset about.

    I wonder though what time he submitted that chargeback today. I will have to check.

    At 1:01 PM MST I received the email from paypal that he had charged back and escalated it to a claim, so I had very little recourse at that point. Paypal lets you dispute or refund. Refund is out of question, I disputed and won.

    @Microlinux said:
    I don't know about that. I would hope a reputable provider would reactivate your prepaid VPS shortly after you accidentally cancelled it. Things did not seem overly egregious early on.

    We can go back and forth all day, I've actually read other TOS and AUP and most all state if you chargeback you risk losing all your services. Please show me a tos or aup that states otherwise.

    Had it been an issue where I clicked terminate on his service wrongly or etc. I would have no problem taking care of the situation. Hell, I'd be clicking create so fast it'd probably DoS the master. A ticket would then follow. His cancellations were submitted by him and he selected immediate, he had roughly 24 hours from that point to ticket and say it was in error. He did not. When the cron ran at 7am, his VM's were terminated.

    Thanked by 1jcaleb
  • @OP

    Since phil does not want to resolve this i suggest you contact the bank.

  • perennateperennate Member, Host Rep
    edited June 2014

    If you cancel immediately, then WHMCS will terminate the VM; if it turns out that the provider doesn't offer partial refunds for that case, then there's nothing the provider can do to restore your VM without going through backups (except, of course, not be a complete asshole in the ticket). So you should always open a ticket instead of submitting cancellation request; this is why most providers have the "immediate cancellation" option disabled entirely: if you don't want VM online anymore then you can shut it down, if you want partial refund you can open a ticket, confusion is avoided.

    Edit: I always hate it when people don't take easy steps to avoid confusion; it's really not hard, for example @AnthonySmith or whoever sends a bunch of emails making it clear that you need to end Paypal subscriptions if you choose that option (although somehow people still forget... lol)

  • You're really being a douche here Phil.

    Thanked by 3Gunter netomx Peroni
  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    Yea me the douche, for someone charging back. You know it. You are delirious!

  • ATHKATHK Member

    Yawn.

  • perennateperennate Member, Host Rep
    edited June 2014

    MCHPhil said: Yea me the douche, for someone charging back. You know it. You are delirious!

    But surely you could've handled the ticket more professionally, even if end result is the same? Had he asked for VM to be rebuilt after first reply, would you have done so?

  • Well, the communication sucks. If OP has asked to reinstate the VPSes back instead of opening dispute, I'd guess Phil would have recreated them. Although, Phil could have offered that as well. Both parties have mistakes.

    I'd like to see Phil taking the first step and reinstating OP's VPSes from backups. I'm sure OP would appreciate it.

    Thanked by 2perennate DalComp
  • the solution going forward:
    stop giving this provider your money for services, and eventually they will go out of business.

    Thanked by 1netomx
  • perennateperennate Member, Host Rep
    edited June 2014

    darkshire said: the solution going forward: stop giving this provider your money for services, and eventually they will go out of business.

    Yes, let's save some money so we can all go to Mars.

    Thanked by 1gsrdgrdghd
  • MCHPhilMCHPhil Member
    edited June 2014

    @perennate said:
    But surely you could've handled the ticket more professionally, even if end result is the same?

    Could have, as I said yes. I took the same tone he took to hopefully show I was as confused as he was. End result was the same.

    The transaction he disputed was originally made on 5/13/2014 16:52 PDT.

  • darkshiredarkshire Member
    edited June 2014

    @GreenValueHost said:
    You're really being a douche here Phil.

    @MCHPhil said:
    Yea me the douche, for someone charging back. You know it. You are delirious!

    holy shit, look at this ! 2 < smart people > at the same time in the same thread !!

  • soulchiefsoulchief Member
    edited June 2014

    MCHPhil said: Could have, as I said yes. I took the same tone he took to hopefully show I was as confused as he was. End result was the same.

    End result is that you turned a ton of potential customers away from your company due to your unprofessional act here. Would have been better off not replying at all, in my opinion.

  • If you plan on ramping up sales and hiring a PR person, I think Comical Ali would be a great fit for your company.

  • Wow! Not only has Phil been a bully to me but to (alot of) other people on here as well.

    MCHPhil said: Not with fraud. That costs me money. Fraudsters can die for all I care.

    In the real world, fraud == prison. Any host will agree with this.

    I am a web hosting as well and no, I don't agree with this. Any other host would agree with this as well. If you're a good and reputable web host, your customers wouldn't be opening a dispute or trying to do a chargeback. If you were smart too, you would give them what they paid for. As far as I am concerned, fraud is when you try to buy something without the bank account owners permission. Maybe in America, but in Canada people don't go to jail for trying to get their own money back because they were defrauded.

    How would you feel if you bought a TV that turned out not to work and you brought it back to the store, only for them to take it from you and not give you a refund? According to @MCH-Phil, your a fraudster and you should go to jail.

    MCHPhil said: I'm sorry you don't seem to understand how WHMCS works. If you submit an immediate cancellation it is automatically cancelled when the cron runs. If he did not tell me that it was a mistake or etc. How would I know. Please go look at the images I posted before continuing. You obviously haven't.

    No, you don't seem to understand how WHMCS works. When somebody submits a cancellation request, you will receive an email right away stating the reason the customer wants a refund and all you have to do is login to WHMCS and delete the cancellation request. Even if I did tell you it was a mistake, you would've still cancelled it. You didn't even mention or ask me if I wanted to cancel it. You need to learn to communicate better.

    MCHPhil said: FYI, paypal is not going to do anything.

    FYI, PayPal did do something. Not only did I get my money back, they're also investigating your account. By all the nasty comments you've been putting on here, your just making it a whole lot easier for them to figure out what kind of business your running.

    It seems the more comments everyone posts here, the more @MCH-Phil's temper gets worse. I'm not one to think I can call people every name in the book and think I can get it away with it because I'm behind a monitor. I don't really want to listen to his attitude so I'm not going to do anymore trolling on this thread, I have better things to do like helping customers.

This discussion has been closed.