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Why providers ignoring abuse?
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Why providers ignoring abuse?

Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

More than a week ago, I sent an report to one of the major hosting companies about a malware C&C server on one of their vps. I sent them all the evidence, including the logs from my transparent proxy.
So far, no response ...

Have you also had such cases?

I post that in "General" for indexing of company names that have a practice of ignoring important abuse reports.

I start:
If you are looking for hosting for your virus, choose Contabo. You will definitely get along with them about ignoring the abuse reports for an additional fee.

Thanked by 2Shakib pike
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Comments

  • ShakibShakib Member, Patron Provider

    @Hotmarer said:
    If you are looking for hosting for your virus, choose Contabo. You will definitely get along with them about ignoring the abuse reports for an additional fee.

    Good tips. 👍

    Thanked by 1iNK79
  • DPDP Administrator, The Domain Guy

    @Hotmarer said:
    Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    More than a week ago, I sent an report to one of the major hosting companies about a malware C&C server on one of their vps. I sent them all the evidence, including the logs from my transparent proxy.
    So far, no response ...

    Have you also had such cases?

    I post that in "General" for indexing of company names that have a practice of ignoring important abuse reports.

    I start:
    If you are looking for hosting for your virus, choose Contabo. You will definitely get along with them about ignoring the abuse reports for an additional fee.

    This thread will also serve as an Abuse Report, so yeah, now you might just get the response you've been waiting for :)

  • ShakibShakib Member, Patron Provider

    @thedp said:

    @Hotmarer said:
    Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    More than a week ago, I sent an report to one of the major hosting companies about a malware C&C server on one of their vps. I sent them all the evidence, including the logs from my transparent proxy.
    So far, no response ...

    Have you also had such cases?

    I post that in "General" for indexing of company names that have a practice of ignoring important abuse reports.

    I start:
    If you are looking for hosting for your virus, choose Contabo. You will definitely get along with them about ignoring the abuse reports for an additional fee.

    This thread will also serve as an Abuse Report, so yeah, now you might just get the response you've been waiting for :)

    @contabo_m

  • HotmarerHotmarer Member
    edited April 2021

    @thedp said: This thread will also serve as an Abuse Report, so yeah, now you might just get the response you've been waiting for

    I'm waiting for it. Without a LET drama, it looks like they won't do anything.

  • It's called privacy.

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited April 2021

    @Hotmarer said: Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    In my country most of your abuse is entirely worthless. You present me a Croatian court order, in Croatian, signed by a Croatian judge with a valid eGOV number i can verify in the Court portal - Then i act.

    Before that, i have absolutely no reason to do anything, and am not liable at all.
    Knowing criminal content is hosted on my servers is NOT ILLEGAL here before a court tells you so.

    We also have no concept of a "secret" order here - Once i have it, regardless for what it is, i have to forward it to my customer or i go to jail.

    Law is from 1994 when Croatia was established, never updated. Government is not very strong here (we already have issues maintaining order with Corona, and half the population is illegally armed) and does not care.

    EDIT: Example, 2 weeks ago they pulled out 200 kilo cocaine owned by a politician in the most remote harbor in Croatia (literally addressed to him). Nobody is in jail. Half the coke disappeared. This is an EU country, just to remind you.

  • HotmarerHotmarer Member
    edited April 2021

    @William said: In my country most of your abuse is entirely worthless. You present me a Croatian court order, in Croatian, signed by a Croatian judge with a valid eGOV number i can verify in the Court portal - Then i act.

    Before that, i have absolutely no reason to do anything, and am not liable at all.
    Knowing criminal content is hosted on my servers is NOT ILLEGAL here before a court tells you so.

    Law is from 1994 when Croatia was established, never updated.

    Interesting :o

  • @Hotmarer said:
    Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    Some providers do act on abuse reports. Perhaps you can share your abuse report here.
    Are you a "real" cybersecurity researcher? It never occurred to me that a low-end VPS user can identify a malware C&C server. I am just curious.

  • fendixfendix Member
    edited April 2021

    cuz some providers doesn't care about abuse reports, me neither.

  • jmgcaguiclajmgcaguicla Member
    edited April 2021

    @chihcherng said: It never occurred to me that a low-end VPS user can identify a malware C&C server

    What's that supposed to mean?

  • @Hotmarer said:
    Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    I think some hosts are less concerned about their IP reputation and blocklists. In my past experience they mostly deal with Spamhaus.

    Some ignored list:

    • BARRACUDA
    • SPAMCOP
    • SPAMRATS
    • .....
  • @fendix said: cuz some providers doesn't care about abuse reports, me neither.

    I care generally, but it is not my business to decide what is legal or not. This is up to a court.

    If i take down something based on abuse only and am wrong, my customer has rights to compensation and i am criminally liable for damages - Why the fuck would i risk that?

  • Unfortunately, there are all too many hosting providers that don't care.

    I recently sent a report to ColoCrossing, because their reseller Virmach has a non-functioning abuse report page, and an email that doesn't accept incoming messages; either way, I got ignored.

    Then Scaleway allowed a bullshit reply from the customer who even admitted to doing it.

    Oracle Cloud ignored me.

    Surprisingly, AWS got back to me quickly and appear to have resolved the abuse.

    I don't mind mentioning providers that seem to ignore abuse in public because as far as I'm concerned it brings them negative attention. If people see this and go to them to abuse, maybe enough people will do so that more people start to complain.

  • DPDP Administrator, The Domain Guy

    Sometimes Abuse Reports can be considered the best form of Denial Of Service :joy:

    Thanked by 3Shakib Cybr pierre
  • @Courvix said: I don't mind mentioning providers that seem to ignore abuse in public because as far as I'm concerned it brings them negative attention.

    Around here at LET it actually brings them more customers.

  • Contabo looks better and better, they got recommend in the hetzner abuse thread also. I think I will move there.
    @Hotmarer write the BSI and they will write contabo, if you go the direct route contabo did right in ignoring you.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    On other threads: "Looking for hosts that ignore DMCA/abuse."

    In this thread: WTF hosts are ignoring abuses.

    Thus, the end is nigh.

  • @William said: In my country most of your abuse is entirely worthless. You present me a Croatian court order, in Croatian, signed by a Croatian judge with a valid eGOV number i can verify in the Court portal - Then i act.

    This is the perfect answer.

  • @William said:

    @fendix said: cuz some providers doesn't care about abuse reports, me neither.

    I care generally, but it is not my business to decide what is legal or not. This is up to a court.

    If i take down something based on abuse only and am wrong, my customer has rights to compensation and i am criminally liable for damages - Why the fuck would i risk that?

    I completely agree with your opinion, I should've phrased it differently.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited April 2021

    @Hotmarer said: Why do you hosting providers ignore abuse reports? Why is no one responding to these reports?

    The number one misunderstanding here is that a provider owes you, likely a non-customer, an action against their paying customer. You are humbly asking, at best. They should be viewing your complaint with skepticism and defaulting to protecting their paying customer, and falling back to honoring your request when they feel that they are not able to legally protect their customer.

    A provider's duty is first to their customer, and at best second to an abuse reporter. The provider's most relevant concern with an abuse reporter is when that reporter has the power to diminish the value of their customer's services (like spamhaus, for example).

    Somehow things shifted to where abuse reporters feel a sense of power and authority as though the mere existence of their complaint means that a corporation should toss out revenue at their demand, and that's not a healthy default perspective at any layer of the transaction. Tossing out revenue on request could be just as damaging to their customer base in the long run as ignoring a legitimate abuse complaint, acting on an illegitimate abuse complaint, etc. Every action has a set of consequences, predictable or otherwise.

    I've nuked customers from orbit based on log audits triggered by abuse reports, I've told abuse reporters to kindly fuck off, and others I've ignored. It's my job as a provider to know when to do which one. It's not anyone else's job to agree with my decision on when to do which, except perhaps my paying customers.

  • Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    Thanked by 1Cybr
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @serv_ee said:
    Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

  • serv_eeserv_ee Member
    edited April 2021

    @jar said:

    @serv_ee said:
    Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

    As long as he doesn't call up for violence (or other stuff that's illegal) I couldn't care less who he is.

    If he's just posting pictures and "admirers" that one person, hell so be it. I don't have to agree with it but I ain't gonna cancel it either just cause someone reports it as abuse.

    Thanked by 2jar Cybr
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @serv_ee said:

    @jar said:

    @serv_ee said:
    Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

    As long as he doesn't call up for violence (or other stuff that's illegal) I couldn't care less who he is.

    If he's just posting pictures and "admirers" that one person, hell so be it. I don't have to agree with it but I ain't gonna cancel it either just cause someone reports it as abuse.

    The joke is that they don’t exist, they were defeated and disbanded 😂

  • serv_eeserv_ee Member
    edited April 2021

    @jar said:

    @serv_ee said:

    @jar said:

    @serv_ee said:
    Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

    As long as he doesn't call up for violence (or other stuff that's illegal) I couldn't care less who he is.

    If he's just posting pictures and "admirers" that one person, hell so be it. I don't have to agree with it but I ain't gonna cancel it either just cause someone reports it as abuse.

    The joke is that they don’t exist, they were defeated and disbanded 😂

    Nazis don't. Neo-nazis do. It's like potato and tomato but...also quite many of them in Russia which is ironic.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll
    edited April 2021

    @jar said:
    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

    Be careful, Jarlard.

    Given the lack of reading comprehension from SJW in general, you might get reported to the police as being a member of the Nazi.

    But I shall vouch for you. You are a member of Jar bottle united.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • @thedp said: Sometimes Abuse Reports can be considered the best form of Denial Of Service

    It's always an idea. Contabo immediately block VPS after a DDoS attack.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited April 2021

    @deank said:

    @jar said:
    Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    (Correct answer is “no, I will immediately terminate anyone from the German National Socialist Workers party”)

    Be careful, Jarlard.

    Given the lack of reading comprehension from SJW in general, you might get reported to the police as being a member of the Nazi.

    But I shall vouch for you. You are a member of Jar bottle united.

    Wouldn’t be the first time 😂

    When you deal with extremists, best to keep documentation of the events. It’s worse when the documentation that could ruin them was written by their own hands and shared with you. That’s only supposed to make sense to the ones that have any likelihood of following me around.

  • @jar said: I've nuked customers from orbit based on log audits triggered by abuse reports, I've told abuse reporters to kindly fuck off, and others I've ignored. It's my job as a provider to know when to do which one. It's not anyone else's job to agree with my decision on when to do which, except perhaps my paying customers.

    I did not mean to block a given VPS immediately, but to inform the client that such a complaint had been received. I understand that a given client does not even have to be responsible for it, maybe he does not know that somebody hacked into his VPS and put something illegal there.

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited April 2021

    @jar said: Are you saying that you would host an actual nazi!?!?

    Aside that real nazis are mostly all dead...

    I am a jew and i gladly host (neo)nazis. I also provided Stormfront with hosting at one point.
    Far right are good customers, always pay on time and aside of DDoS operate 100% legal freedom of speech covered sites.

    I am here for business, not for ideology. I don't give a shit what my customers think if they pay. I will protect their freedom of speech with every drop of blood in my body, IF THEY PAY FOR IT.

    EDIT: This got me into trouble with Israeli laws before, but i stood my point that a US site/owner cannot be subject to Israeli laws even if i as the provider am citizen. Was thrown out ultimately, because the case was insanely dumb anyway - I don't live in Israel, i don't host in Israel, my customer is not Israeli and my company is not either, so there was no jurisdiction aside of my citizenship.

    @serv_ee said: Soon all that cancel culture and SJWs will form a new group who will send reports to everything on the net and some providers start pulling down sites cause "I don't like what he said hurr durr"

    I get these all the time, especially for anti trans content. They go to trash. I don't forward them to protect the abuse sender, but that is merely a personal decision.

    Thanked by 1jar
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