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A member live in China near Wuhan wanna talk about SARS-COV-2 - Page 2
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A member live in China near Wuhan wanna talk about SARS-COV-2

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Comments

  • DON'T PANIC

  • @TimboJones said:
    How do people get tested? Do they need to go to a clinic for blood tests, or some one delivers a kit you administer at home? What is the result response time?

    Thanks

    The suspecious person who shows symptoms(body tempreture higher than 37.3 celcius, cough, difficult breath, weakness) will be delivered by negative air pressure ambulance or other emergency service like police car to appointed fever clinic take CT scan and RT-PCR test.

    At this time,RT-PCR test result is the key to adjust infected or not infected. The RT-PCR result combine the CT scan result confirmation response less than 24 hrs.

    Oh yes, it's not blood sample, but throat body liquid sample.

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
  • @pike said:
    Robert-Koch-Institute says wearing face masks is useful only to those already infected and helpers/medics, and only in situations where they're exposed to the public/other humans or patients in case of medics. Also regular face masks are not suitable for long-term usage aka. wearing them longer than 20 minutes.

    So, to avoid shortages on masks for people that actually need them, it's advised to not buy them.

    Washing hands the right way is the most important thing to do.

    Also it's advised to get vaccinated against all diseases that affect the lungs.

    Yes, we do not recommend to buy (more exactly occupy )the local medical resources.

    But if can get some non-medical useage masks (like industry usage ) don't hesitate to buy some.Especially in high risk area (like me in Hubei province, Italy, Korea, Iran, maybe Japan) or you have to walk into crowd, or you have to talk with non-protect person.You never know who has been infected.

    By official advice of our goverment and CDC (China) , wear masks is the basic rule No.1, for reference.

  • @imfan said:
    But if can get some non-medical useage masks (like industry usage ) don't hesitate to buy some.

    This is dumb. SARS-COV-2 is so tiny it passes through any mask you can find, even N95. You wear masks NOT to protect yourself but to prevent spreading to others. A mask does not stop the virus from entering your body through mucus membranes in your eyes.

    Thanked by 1pike
  • @pike said:
    Robert-Koch-Institute says wearing face masks is useful only to those already infected and helpers/medics, and only in situations where they're exposed to the public/other humans or patients in case of medics. Also regular face masks are not suitable for long-term usage aka. wearing them longer than 20 minutes.

    So, to avoid shortages on masks for people that actually need them, it's advised to not buy them.

    Washing hands the right way is the most important thing to do.

    Also it's advised to get vaccinated against all diseases that affect the lungs.

    The thing is that you can't be 100% sure that you are infected. Plus, those high level masks are known to stop virus carried by aerosol. KCDC (Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) also recommend using KF80 or higher level masks when you need to see many people.

  • @poisson said:

    @imfan said:
    But if can get some non-medical useage masks (like industry usage ) don't hesitate to buy some.

    This is dumb. SARS-COV-2 is so tiny it passes through any mask you can find, even N95. You wear masks NOT to protect yourself but to prevent spreading to others. A mask does not stop the virus from entering your body through mucus membranes in your eyes.

    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

  • @jar said:

    MadRabbit said: What I meant was that on what do you base your assumption on?

    It has a higher R0 and death rate based on estimates. Seasonal flu has an R0 of 2-3, 2019-nCoV has been estimated to have an R0 of 1.5-3.5, some sources reporting 1.4-4.08. Conservative death rates are around 2-3% (not yet sure why Iran is reporting upwards of 15%, could be an anomaly in how they're reporting). Estimates expect anywhere from 40-70% of the population to contract the virus.

    Sure they're small numbers individually, but they support my statement. You're welcome to consider them fake, it's the best data I've been able to get my hands on to date. I haven't seen any conflicting data supporting a different statement besides things like "lol it's nothing bc I said so." Certainly I won't be in trouble for having some extra food and tylenol on hand.

    In epidemiology, R0 is used to determine whether a disease is likely to persist in the population and says nothing about the severity of the disease. R0 > 1 means the disease is likely to persist, while R0 < 1 means the disease is likely to disappear in the population.

    You should be looking at other measures such as case fatality rates to come to conclusions about disease severity and burdens. What R0 is and isn't and the complexities behind it is beyond most of us. From the Emerging Infectious Disease Journal:

    "Although R0 might appear to be a simple measure that can be used to determine infectious disease transmission dynamics and the threats that new outbreaks pose to the public health, the definition, calculation, and interpretation of R0 are anything but simple. R0 remains a valuable epidemiologic concept, but the expanded use of R0 in both the scientific literature and the popular press appears to have enabled some misunderstandings to propagate."

    Source: https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/25/1/17-1901_article

  • @jackb said:
    Also worth noting that N95 masks are only good for ~8h usage (cumulative not per usage) and are hard to get ahold of in the west for under £10 now.

    I'm going without. I'd rather spend £50 on some antiviral whisky than 5 masks.

    Stay safe @imfan.

    @poisson said:

    @imfan said:
    But if can get some non-medical useage masks (like industry usage ) don't hesitate to buy some.

    This is dumb. SARS-COV-2 is so tiny it passes through any mask you can find, even N95. You wear masks NOT to protect yourself but to prevent spreading to others. A mask does not stop the virus from entering your body through mucus membranes in your eyes.

    The virus itselt (100 nm particle) seems can pass through the masks obviously, but the masks still can reduce the passed virus number to make a chance let your body immune system to deal with less amount of virus.

    More inportant, most of the SARS-COV-2 spread by attach on micro liquid particle when patient cough, those particle are more like 300 nm(aka PM3 like PM2.5) can be easily blocked by masks.

    The key is the amount, small amount of virus the immune system can deal. With no protection, it's hard to say.

  • @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

  • @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

    True, but it's better to leave only 1 point of enterence vs 3

  • @imfan said:
    The key is the amount, small amount of virus the immune system can deal. With no protection, it's hard to say.

    Fully agreed. However, in MOST places, MOST people are uninfected, so your risk is so low, you are MOST UNLIKELY to be in a situation where the viral concentrations of SARS-COV-2 in your surroundings are so high that you need a mask.

    In Hubei, I agree everyone should wear masks if they are in public. So should people in Daegu and Cheongdo. The rest of the world where risks are low, please be considerate and save the masks for people in most affected areas.

    Thanked by 2sanvit vimalware
  • @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

    True, but it's better to leave only 1 point of enterence vs 3

    Yes. However, if we consider the fact that masks are not unlimited and if everyone wears masks to reduce a tiny probability by one-third, soon enough, masks will run out for EVERYONE and nobody gets any level of protection.

    If masks are infinite in supply, sure, everyone please wear them all the time. The problem is that it is a finite supply. Advocating mask wearing for everyone is a bit like the prisoner's dilemma; we are all worse off unless we cooperate.

    Thanked by 2imfan sanvit
  • @poisson said:

    @imfan said:
    The key is the amount, small amount of virus the immune system can deal. With no protection, it's hard to say.

    Fully agreed. However, in MOST places, MOST people are uninfected, so your risk is so low, you are MOST UNLIKELY to be in a situation where the viral concentrations of SARS-COV-2 in your surroundings are so high that you need a mask.

    In Hubei, I agree everyone should wear masks if they are in public. So should people in Daegu and Cheongdo. The rest of the world where risks are low, please be considerate and save the masks for people in most affected areas.

    Damn I forget you guys are not in high risk area, my fault.

    Well, stay focus on local cases status and be prepared to face the situation change, I'm still concern about if there will be an out break because of arrogant like we have passed.

    Some country are not able to deal with big out break which will heavily crush the medical treatment then cause panic, that would be the worst ever.

    Thanked by 1poisson
  • @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

    True, but it's better to leave only 1 point of enterence vs 3

    Yes. However, if we consider the fact that masks are not unlimited and if everyone wears masks to reduce a tiny probability by one-third, soon enough, masks will run out for EVERYONE and nobody gets any level of protection.

    If masks are infinite in supply, sure, everyone please wear them all the time. The problem is that it is a finite supply. Advocating mask wearing for everyone is a bit like the prisoner's dilemma; we are all worse off unless we cooperate.

    True, and that's happening in South Korea (mask price up to 5-10x original price, and that's even hard to get). But there will always be someone wearing masks, and they will be more safer than those who don't. And in disastrous situations like this, one should take care of themselves. And you should note that mask is still being produced. There will always be more masks produced than the number of people who really needs them (e.g. people who work for medical institutes/elders and patients/those who are likely to be infected or already infected). But it's the government's job to take care of these people's mask supplies. You should take care of your own health.

    Thanked by 2poisson imfan
  • @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

    True, but it's better to leave only 1 point of enterence vs 3

    Yes. However, if we consider the fact that masks are not unlimited and if everyone wears masks to reduce a tiny probability by one-third, soon enough, masks will run out for EVERYONE and nobody gets any level of protection.

    If masks are infinite in supply, sure, everyone please wear them all the time. The problem is that it is a finite supply. Advocating mask wearing for everyone is a bit like the prisoner's dilemma; we are all worse off unless we cooperate.

    True, and that's happening in South Korea (mask price up to 5-10x original price, and that's even hard to get). But there will always be someone wearing masks, and they will be more safer than those who don't. And in disastrous situations like this, one should take care of themselves. And you should note that mask is still being produced. There will always be more masks produced than the number of people who really needs them (e.g. people who work for medical institutes/elders and patients/those who are likely to be infected or already infected). But it's the government's job to take care of these people's mask supplies. You should take care of your own health.

    Make sense, be safe in KOR.

    I believe our country will provide help since we deal our trouble here, as what your country had helped us in the beginning.

    Our gov have mobilized many company accelerate the production of masks, hope this will help our neighbors.

    Thanked by 1sanvit
  • @imfan said:

    @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:

    @poisson said:

    @sanvit said:
    Corona Virus is known to be able to spread through aerosols, and N95/KF94 masks are able to stop aerosol particles passing through, so yes, masks can help. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, masks prevent you from unintentionally touching your mouth/nose which also helps

    Yes, this is what I am referring to when I say that you wear masks to protect other people by reducing the probability of you transmitting the virus to others. However, the mask doesn't protect you because the aerosols carrying the virus can also enter through your eyes!

    True, but it's better to leave only 1 point of enterence vs 3

    Yes. However, if we consider the fact that masks are not unlimited and if everyone wears masks to reduce a tiny probability by one-third, soon enough, masks will run out for EVERYONE and nobody gets any level of protection.

    If masks are infinite in supply, sure, everyone please wear them all the time. The problem is that it is a finite supply. Advocating mask wearing for everyone is a bit like the prisoner's dilemma; we are all worse off unless we cooperate.

    True, and that's happening in South Korea (mask price up to 5-10x original price, and that's even hard to get). But there will always be someone wearing masks, and they will be more safer than those who don't. And in disastrous situations like this, one should take care of themselves. And you should note that mask is still being produced. There will always be more masks produced than the number of people who really needs them (e.g. people who work for medical institutes/elders and patients/those who are likely to be infected or already infected). But it's the government's job to take care of these people's mask supplies. You should take care of your own health.

    Make sense, be safe in KOR.

    I believe our country will provide help since we deal our trouble here, as what your country had helped us in the beginning.

    Our gov have mobilized many company accelerate the production of masks, hope this will help our neighbors.

    Thanks for the kind words. Be safe and take care of yourself!
    Hope people can find a cure soon.

  • elliotcelliotc Member
    edited February 2020
    1. N95 mask needs fitting test. Normal mask would be better in most use case. You can not breath if you wearing it correctly. Leave N95 to the professional.
    2. Point 2 deleted.
  • As I already wrote in another thread, I live in Italy in an area where 650 cases have been detected to date, here was a case of a 38-year-old patient with pneumonia and fever for 5 days who was found positive that he got infected in Italy without connections with China and so tests were made to all the people in contact with him and in cascade over 10,000 tests were also made to asymptomatic people, we have quarantined entire areas and at a wider range put bans at various gatherings, in Germany 2 days ago a forty-three was found with pneumonia and fever for days, he is positive and that it is not known where he took it but the government decided to test only those who have symptoms, no strategy to stop the spread, same thing in France, a person who died in Paris without knowing who got infected and declared that they will swab only those who have feverish and respiratory symptoms, no strategy to stop the spread as deed in China and Italy.

    The differences between flu and coronavirus are that for influenza we have antibodies because they are always the same 3 strains, we have vaccines and medicines, for coronavirus we don't have them, coronavirus goes deeper into the respiratory tract and creates serious pneumonia even in young subjects, in Italy 20% of the infected were hospitalized, I think it is understandable that if it spreads with the flu numbers in certain countries it would not be possible to have hospitals and drugs to hospitalize all those people.

    Thanked by 1chihcherng
  • @poisson said:

    @imfan said:

    Please be considerate and save the masks for people in most affected areas.

    You don't understand why humans are a virus. /s
    I'm going to look at the bright side and hope the fear of an airborne pathogen, will keep my countrymen from hacking each other to pieces, over insults to their imaginary friend(s?) .

    It's a pyramid of shit over here. Sigh.

    Thanked by 2poisson uptime
  • The death rate is not always 1-2%.
    In province like Zhejiang, the death rate is under 0.1%, but in most cities around Wuhan, the deatch rate is around 3% now.
    We are not allowed to go to supermarket to get food, everything is ordered online and delivered by designated person.
    Some regions have adopted a system of rewarding $ 1,000 to $ 3,000 for confirmed patients.
    We don’t have to worry about water and electricity. Electricity stopped twice and it was fixed when I was calling 95588.
    The main road is unobstructed, and all small paths are blocked by colored steel plates. The speed is like playing Minecraft, and a steel wall is added to the bridge overnight.
    Hotels, hotels, schools, gymnasiums, and warehouses have been requisitioned, and temporary isolation houses have been constructed in various places to prevent the situation from deteriorating.
    Workers built temporary isolation houses get paid several times more than usual. Medical teams supported by other provinces and cities are arranged to rest in the best hotels and resorts, subsequent donations of food and material resources in their province are endless, with the best quality. There are publicity and patrol vehicles on the road 24x7. Volunteers are available at almost every intersection. It takes more than 5 inspections to go from town to town.

  • imfanimfan Member
    edited February 2020

    @jar said:
    Also remember that appropriate preparation is not panic. It's stupid not to prepare for it.

    jackb said: Russian roulette has a higher death rate

    But less people will play it. If 1% of everyone you know dies it's not exactly equivalent. So prepare. Because the rate of infection combined with the fatality rate is the one key (and using one without the other is not doing it justice), and the panic making it difficult to get supplies and medical care is another key. You don't even want the seasonal flu without medicine or food, so make sure to get both because the panic will make those just a little harder.

    It doesn't have to be the zombie apocalypse to be bad, and there is a middle ground between flying to China to party and boarding up your windows. Don't panic, but don't be caught with your pants down either.

    Yes, the panic is the biggest enemy, but not the virus.

    We here in China many people faced the panic at the bigging of infection, people crowded to buy massive amount daily supply like vegetables/meat and main food(rice and wheat flour), and medical supply like masks and 75% alcohol.

    And alot of people have normal flu have fever crowded in specialized fever clinic wanna to confirm thay have infected or not, maybe more than 10kilo per day per hospital.This may cause widely spread cause the R0 too high.

    This is horrible if continue, and on that time we don't have plenty of test equipment/materia/human resource to complete all of portential pathents' test process and treatments cause the chinese new year holiday.Many people have go back to home and line up to get test and get cure.Our goverment and all citizens spend huge mount of money and human resource to prevent the situation become more un-controlable. Don't wanna talk more about this.

    Anyway, all other country goverment and citizen have time to prepare to face the virus infection cause we have tried our best to stop/slow down the virus spread and learn some useful experience, as a chinese near deeply in the infected area I have to try to tell the LET members not panic and get ready to protect themselves and their family stay away from panic.

  • Good luck to all of you! From Tantai,Shandong Province,China

    Thanked by 1BBTN
  • NyrNyr Community Contributor, Veteran

    Very interesting insight indeed.

    And good look to you all, specially for all the Chinese citizens doing such a great sacrifice and effort, not only for themselves but for the rest of the world.

    Thanked by 1vimalware
  • @Neoon said:

    @hkvip8 said:

    @Neoon said:
    The thing is, that what the chinese said, it kills only the old people was bullshit.
    It can even get your ass if your are young and healthy.

    Its rather unlikely but yea.


    开始说是老年人容易感染,死亡率高的的也是老年人,什么时候说只是老年人会感染死亡,年轻人不会,不要断章取义,污蔑我们国家好吗?

    Of course we slender countries, all the time, no exceptions.
    Mainly the chinese goverment claimed, that it only hits old or/and vulnerable people, which was pure bullshit as we now know.

    I mean think of it, would you go into Wuhan as Doctor if you would know, it could kill you? No you would not.

    中国人不惧怕,中国每个地区支援武汉的医疗队伍,无惧牺牲的医护人员,是值得尊敬的。他们在春节放弃和家人朋友团聚的机会,依然去支援武汉,国家需要我的时候,我们依然做好了准备,哪怕牺牲自己也要控制疫情。我不知道你从哪里看到的新闻,只是断章取义。建议你下载'今日头条',了解一下我们所做的努力。

  • What masks work for facial hair people?

  • @TimboJones said:
    What masks work for facial hair people?

    Funnily enough the CDC has it all mapped out: https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2017/11/02/noshave/

    It's an older article but the image is making the rounds on social media.

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
  • @TimRoo said:

    @TimboJones said:
    What masks work for facial hair people?

    Funnily enough the CDC has it all mapped out: https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2017/11/02/noshave/

    It's an older article but the image is making the rounds on social media.

    Thanks. Someone else posted the image but wasn't zoomable and couldn't see details.

    I've had the circle beard for over 20 years. So, to rephrase, "what masks work for facial hair people who don't want to shave?" I'm expecting some CDC bee keeper/astronaut type of fully enclosed head/body suit.

  • @TimboJones said:

    @TimRoo said:

    @TimboJones said:
    What masks work for facial hair people?

    Funnily enough the CDC has it all mapped out: https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2017/11/02/noshave/

    It's an older article but the image is making the rounds on social media.

    Thanks. Someone else posted the image but wasn't zoomable and couldn't see details.

    I've had the circle beard for over 20 years. So, to rephrase, "what masks work for facial hair people who don't want to shave?" I'm expecting some CDC bee keeper/astronaut type of fully enclosed head/body suit.

    I'm surprised that US CDC have researched this question.

    Well, I have circle beard for about six years, but since I have to take train both subway and railway after the first several days outbreak, I shave them all to wear masks.I always refuse to shave but this time.

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
  • @TimboJones said:
    What masks work for facial hair people?

    You can grow a new beard, not sure if you can grow new kidneys.

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
  • @xaoc said:

    @TimboJones said:
    What masks work for facial hair people?

    You can grow a new beard, not sure if you can grow new kidneys.

    Lol

    Thanked by 1xaoc
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