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What do you want to see on LEB? - Page 2
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What do you want to see on LEB?

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Comments

  • jbilohjbiloh Administrator, Veteran

    MikePT said: Full transparency from now on would be a good start, like you did above. However, the "we" term isn't transparent at all.

    Me, a content writer who has been writing up the offers and a buddy who is helping on the technical side.

    MikePT said: The changes you need to do don't take that long as well.

    I am going to give it a good effort.

    AuroraZ said: Look man I have been in this business a long, long time. I have seen companies and people come and go, and most of them spew the same rhetoric.

    We have this in common. Amazingly it's been nearly 20 years since I started my first web hosting company.

    AuroraZ said: I am not sure the damage can be fixed at this point, you have let so many scam and out right thefts go on under the nose of these sites that I hardly buy from here anymore. I would not touch a LEB host if I had to shut down all my sites and pack it in.

    Consistency and effort will make a difference over time I feel.

    Thanked by 1MikePT
  • IonSwitch_StanIonSwitch_Stan Member, Host Rep

    Me, a content writer who has been writing up the offers

    A place to start might be reading the offers that are posted. I commented the other day that one recently stated a providers whois was public, when it was very much not, the comment was approved, but the inaccurate offer exists.

  • @IonSwitch_Stan said:

    Me, a content writer who has been writing up the offers

    A place to start might be reading the offers that are posted. I commented the other day that one recently stated a providers whois was public, when it was very much not, the comment was approved, but the inaccurate offer exists.

    A cleanup of old offers breaking LEB rules maybe?

  • Sigh.

    Another offer posted today (!!) that is over LEB limits.

    https://lowendbox.com/blog/illyhosting-kvm-offers-premium-performance-with-prices-starting-at-e4-95-month/

    Please.

    Thanked by 2default SinV
  • @teamacc said:
    Sigh.

    Another offer posted today (!!) that is over LEB limits.

    https://lowendbox.com/blog/illyhosting-kvm-offers-premium-performance-with-prices-starting-at-e4-95-month/

    Please.

    Should send this thread to Deluxe fraud check division

  • Type your comment

  • What's LEB?

  • @jbiloh kudos for the explanations, I hope you can turn things around. It'll be a challenge to get public perception of LEB to improve but you're probably one of the few people with the skills to do so.

    Did you hear that @teamacc? Change is coming (again, this time...)

    Thanked by 2Falzo SinV
  • FalzoFalzo Member
    edited February 2020

    jbiloh said: moving forward.

    Falzo said: requests like you do here are a perfect start for that... if you really consider and follow the feedback! if it's just pretending simply spare the effort. your investors or shareholders want to see reliable recurring revenue and not short term sale pushing with unsustainable crap.

    Quality feedback is critically important, I agree. There are no investors, shareholders, or anyone else involved at this point. As the moderators already know, a couple weeks ago I acquired Low End Box and Low End Talk from Deluxe. This marks the first time in many, many years that LEB and LET are not owned by a company in the hosting industry. For example, I've already eliminated most of the ads on LET and the same will be done with LEB over the next week or so after I am done moving the websites to their new server platform.

    I see. I wasn't aware that this was somehow split. may I ask of your current connection to Deluxe or CC then? sorry, if this has been mentioned somewhere already, but I have been quite busy and not followed all threads in all boards regardings this ;-)

    Falzo said: I understand that your main interest isn't selling directly but providing an attractive platform for your partners to sell on.

    Today my main focus on the community. In the past it was a mix between commercial and the community (I was never the Darth Vader some made me out to be!).

    okay. thanks for clarifying. I guess it's up to you then, what you want to achieve with both places. using it as a platform for helping and promoting indirect sales would still be a reasonable goal, if communicated properly.
    also personally earning some money with ads, affilliates whatever could also be a valid intention. so far not neccessarily any kind of dark side for me to be honest.
    from my point of view both can be done while respecting the community and even get benefits from it - though I'd expect you to really try and take on an honest and somewhat neutral position.

    however if you really decide to run it just and only for the fun and people, I think you'll have to focus 100% on their wishes for quite some time to gain back some trust, which you probably lost more or less completely.
    I get that this might hurt and will be difficult though, but I think it's the only way. maybe for that you would even need to rest any activities that show connections to the old owners for quite a while... gain a healthy distance between You (and LET/LEB as part of that) and CC/Deluxe as quickly as possible.

    TL;DR; actions speak louder than words.

  • LeeLee Veteran

    Lee said: Something is changing on LEB and he is going to try and make it look like he asked the community first.

    Yup, you are correct.

    Thanked by 2default NinjaNOC
  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker

    @jbiloh

    • I'm sorry, I really am, but I don't believe anything you say.
    • The worst and most grave problems of all isn't this or that related to LEB or LET but the fact that you/CC/Deluxe have lost any and every trust.
    • Due to absolutely no trust communication between you and us is a very very narrow road (if possible at all).

    ==> Show us something, some real and tangible progress!

    That and that alone can create a basis for meaningful communication - without which improving LET as well as the relationship between you and us is impossible.

    Thanked by 2default SinV
  • servarica_haniservarica_hani Member, Patron Provider

    OK I usually dont write much but I think this post will be helpful

    Now since the owner ship is moved to you (individual) we need to be clear and transparent on few things

    1- What is your revenue model from LEB and LET ?
    As someone who own the site and putting effort on it , you expected and accepted to generate revenue from this
    Being clear on this from day one will make life much easier for you and many of the users here will be actually on your side

    So is the revenue model
    a) through the ad banners on both sides ?
    b)or you plan to offer advertisement posts in LEB ? and if yes how much is the persantage of the total posts on LEB ?
    c) Are you planning to make some posts pinned for money on LEB like WHT (so all content is fee but if somoen whant their post to be on first page or first post they have to pay ? ) . and if you do this what are the limits of pinning

    2- The other important question how and who decide what is posted on LEB ?
    having very clear guidance here and transparency will make it easier for you and client will appreciate it more

    One suggestion i have is to have a set of users of here as community that decide what is posted on LEB , those users are known and they get voted every 6 month or 1 year

    This way you have zero blame for what is being posted on LEB and since this is community based site you let the community decide which for sure will be better than single person deciding

    3- reporting
    reporting every 3 months or so to show the users that the sites follow their own rules and explain why some choices are made is the best way to get the confidence back

    Thanks

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
  • NinjaNOC said: I wonder Jon... Does your mother share your business ethics for her daycare outfit? Because, if yes, then it might be time to inform her customers. Social media and all that, you know... Could become ugly.

    Fuck you!

  • jbilohjbiloh Administrator, Veteran

    IonSwitch_Stan said: A place to start might be reading the offers that are posted. I commented the other day that one recently stated a providers whois was public, when it was very much not, the comment was approved, but the inaccurate offer exists.

    I see a few that are not following pricing rules. I am going to talk this over with the content writer so she's aware of the limits so we can avoid that in the future. In the meantime please link me to the one that violating the rules and I will fix it.

    teamacc said: A cleanup of old offers breaking LEB rules maybe?

    Yes, agreed.

    teamacc said: Another offer posted today (!!) that is over LEB limits.

    Going to get this fixed.

    dahartigan said: @jbiloh kudos for the explanations, I hope you can turn things around. It'll be a challenge to get public perception of LEB to improve but you're probably one of the few people with the skills to do so.

    Thank you, I appreciate the nice words.

    Falzo said: I see. I wasn't aware that this was somehow split. may I ask of your current connection to Deluxe or CC then? sorry, if this has been mentioned somewhere already, but I have been quite busy and not followed all threads in all boards regardings this ;-)

    I like the people at Deluxe and care about the employees and customers at ColoCrossing deeply. I am a consultant who advises on things to help where I can.

    Falzo said: okay. thanks for clarifying. I guess it's up to you then, what you want to achieve with both places. using it as a platform for helping and promoting indirect sales would still be a reasonable goal, if communicated properly. also personally earning some money with ads, affilliates whatever could also be a valid intention. so far not neccessarily any kind of dark side for me to be honest.

    I would like the website to make some money. Right now my focus is on removing most of the ads so that the ones that are left are sure to create very strong value for the advertisers. Based on my review once all of that is done the websites should break even. Eventually I'd like to see that increase, because everyone wants to make a few bucks for their effort, but I am taking a long term approach here.

    NinjaNOC said: I wonder Jon... Does your mother share your business ethics for her daycare outfit? Because, if yes, then it might be time to inform her customers. Social media and all that, you know... Could become ugly.

    Well that's not very nice.

    jsg said: ==> Show us something, some real and tangible progress!

    Progress has already started happening my friend.

    servarica_hani said: 1- What is your revenue model from LEB and LET ?

    As per above, right now the revenue model is have less of it, hah. I want to grow traffic and eventually will examine how the website can become more financially viable because right now it isn't.

    servarica_hani said: 3- reporting. reporting every 3 months or so to show the users that the sites follow their own rules and explain why some choices are made is the best way to get the confidence back

    I like this idea. Will see about the time resources needed to do this.

    servarica_hani said: c) Are you planning to make some posts pinned for money on LEB like WHT (so all content is fee but if somoen whant their post to be on first page or first post they have to pay ? ) . and if you do this what are the limits of pinning

    No

    Thanked by 1SinV
  • Does this mean CC will stop sponsoring provider ?

  • IonSwitch_StanIonSwitch_Stan Member, Host Rep

    @jbiloh can we expect some level of accountability and screening for LEB and LET providers in the future?

    We have quickly let Black Friday slide - where (40?) providers were shilled by LEB with email campaigns and spam that many of us did not sign up for. Many of those providers deadpooled shortly thereafter.

    There’s never been any transparency around what happened, what CC/Deluxe role in the scam was, but it’s clear CC/Deluxe benefitted from it, knows who else benefitted from it, and was pushing long term deals on the community.

    Why do I trust @poisson ’s list of providers over LEB? Do you find it acceptable that LEB’s tract record at this point is scammy bottom feeders that are entirely anonymous and have the highest statistical possibility of deadpooling?

    Thanked by 2SinV Ympker
  • deankdeank Member, Troll
    edited February 2020

    Dude, fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

    In this case, fool me seven times - don't even bother.

    Besides, the last time you posted a shit thread like this, LET/LEB went downhill fast. I reckon the same thing will occur.

  • The end is nigh.

    Thanked by 2deank uptime
  • @NinjaNOC said:
    I wonder Jon... Does your mother share your business ethics for her daycare outfit? Because, if yes, then it might be time to inform her customers. Social media and all that, you know... Could become ugly.

    Just to be on the safe side: This is no threat from my side. I do not even have any social media accounts. But other people have. And the idea is already broadly discussed at certain places.

    Bad form man, sorry but this should not even have come up. His mother has nothing to do with his him or his character. He is a big boy and makes his own decisions. Family and friends have nothing to do with it.

    Ultimately his decisions are his alone, and his responsibility. Not his family or friends.

    Truth be told I have nothing against @jbiloh except his own actions. I do not care what some one else says, it his actions and through him his companies. He could be an awesome guy with bad business ethics and/or decisions. I do not know, but his actions speak differently.

    Might be a good idea to leave family and friends out of this discussion in the future. If you have a problem with @jbiloh concentrate on him, and leave others out of it.

  • I think the only way reconciliation with the community happens is when you take the equilivant $ amount for all add revenue from the duration where leb openly advertised scams (colocrossing products) and donate it to charity. Otherwise id personally be more inclined to trust prout than leb ever.

  • poissonpoisson Member
    edited February 2020

    I see absolutely zero contrition for all the harms that were done by CC and the Jon/Chris gang in the past. This is an attempt to whitewash history. The community here can forgive and forget, but not without a commensurate demonstration of contrition for the harms done.

    If you ask me, if @jbiloh really cares about the community, he would turn over ownership of LET and LEB to someone who is clearly untainted and allow them free reign to clean up the entire shit. Until this happens, LET and LEB will never escape its past shadow. Deluxe/CC will still be eating internet shit and these shit will be indexed and archived for eternity.

    Thanked by 1default
  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    Nah, CC can have LEB. Let LET be free though.

    Thanked by 1default
  • PieHasBeenEatenPieHasBeenEaten Member, Host Rep

    @NinjaNOC Please learn to be respectful of others. What you said was very disrespectful and was uncalled for. Really I should ban you for a week for it.

  • Leave up the scam host posts, but remove links to their services. Give 'em great SEO, and perhaps a place to research comments from customers.

    Hostflyte deleted my VPS, and it was out for over 3 weeks. They had a line on their website:

    In the event there is unplanned service interruption, we will compensate a 1 day service extension for every minute offline

    https://imgur.com/a/3LwZzbW

    My math, 22 days outage, 1440 minutes per day = 31,680 days service extension, or more than 86 years. I was told a refund was on the way, in OCTOBER, and Hostflyte refuses to take action on it. They closed the ticket a few times, and it's just been sitting. It would be nice if they would stick to their word, but I'm certainly not holding my breath.

    I've always said that it's my low-cost lesson into VPS... maybe, just maybe LEB could serve as making others aware of scum, scammers, and summer-hosts.

  • jbilohjbiloh Administrator, Veteran

    Here are a few interesting questions I'd like to hear feedback on:

    1. What guidelines does the community recommend for screening hosts to minimize the risk of failure and subsequent impact to our community and general consumers?

    2. At what point, if ever, should one or multi-year deal term length be allowed on LEB?

    3. What should the minimum and maximum price points be for VPS, VPN, Web Hosting and dedicated servers be on LEB?

    4. How should things be handled when a host does fail and announces that they are going out of business?

    5. How should LEB monitor, on an ongoing basis, the performance and general satisfaction of end user consumers who purchase services from hosts who benefit from the free offer posts on LEB?

  • @PieHasBeenEaten said:
    @NinjaNOC Please learn to be respectful of others. What you said was very disrespectful and was uncalled for. Really I should ban you for a week for it.

    I would like to see him banned for longer than a week for that. Things are really fucked up when someone's mother (family/friends) gets dragged into drama.

    Thanked by 1jsg
  • @jbiloh said:
    Here are a few interesting questions I'd like to hear feedback on:

    1. What guidelines does the community recommend for screening hosts to minimize the risk of failure and subsequent impact to our community and general consumers?

    For a new host, limit to monthly payments until they have survived LEB for no less than 1 year without major incident. That's a starting point.

    1. At what point, if ever, should one or multi-year deal term length be allowed on LEB?

    See above, 1 year clean track history on LEB.

    1. What should the minimum and maximum price points be for VPS, VPN, Web Hosting and dedicated servers be on LEB?

    VPS - $7 max, not sure a minimum is required in the spirit of being low end and very cheap.

    1. How should things be handled when a host does fail and announces that they are going out of business?

    To avoid past mistakes, don't promote those hosts further. I would also suggest removing order links from older posts,

    1. How should LEB monitor, on an ongoing basis, the performance and general satisfaction of end user consumers who purchase services from hosts who benefit from the free offer posts on LEB?

    With a thumb on the pulse. LEB have comments, if genuinely unbiased, would be a good general indicator. Perhaps a system whereby LET mods/admins can report concerning providers to you with a more serious approach taken to their feedback.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    The old rules you scrapped are the rules that need to be restored.

    I am sure you knew that already. Why ask?

  • BTW the above advice is gonna cost you tree fiddy.

  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker
    edited February 2020

    @jbiloh said:
    Here are a few interesting questions I'd like to hear feedback on:

    1. What guidelines does the community recommend for screening hosts to minimize the risk of failure and subsequent impact to our community and general consumers?

    What guidelines do users themselves follow to minimize ...? How do LET admins/mods try to minimize ... (if left alone and not overruled by you(CC/Deluxe)?

    1. At what point, if ever, should one or multi-year deal term length be allowed on LEB?

    I don't care what you do in LEB which has become a waste dump with obtrusive ads. I'm interested in LET only.

    1. What should the minimum and maximum price points be for VPS, VPN, Web Hosting and dedicated servers be on LEB?

    I don't care what you do in LEB which has become a waste dump with obtrusive ads. I'm interested in LET only.

    1. How should things be handled when a host does fail and announces that they are going out of business?

    I don't care what you do in LEB which has become a waste dump with obtrusive ads. I'm interested in LET only.

    1. How should LEB monitor, on an ongoing basis, the performance and general satisfaction of end user consumers who purchase services from hosts who benefit from the free offer posts on LEB?

    I don't care what you do in LEB which has become a waste dump with obtrusive ads. I'm interested in LET only.

    Years ago I occasionally had a look at LEB but since quite some time I would look at LEB only to have a list of hosts to avoid.

    Oh, and: Nice start! 4 out of 5 questions about LEB and none, zero directly about LET.

    Which part of "LEB and LET is not one community" did you not get? They may have been years ago, but YOU forced LEB ads and LEB threads upon us and YOU turned our admins and mods into helpless zombies who were forced to tolerate LEB scum here at LET and if they dared to object you ignored them and threw them at the feet of LEB scammers to laugh at and sh_t on them.

    Oh and btw, in case you didn't notice, there is "the other LET" now, LES, which will suffocate LET & LEB in the long run, unless you give our admins and mods the power to repair the immense damage YOU have done to our community and stop reigning in from above.
    You do N_O_T know better than we, the LET community, what we want and need.. So, asking us would be a good start theoretically if there still was any trust in you left.

    (Side note: No, I'm not your enemy. In fact, I'm one of the not so many who would at least look at it, if you happened to really did something good for LET.)

    Thanked by 2poisson seriesn
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