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Comments
I am sure you can give fake details in China without complaints. You are not giving confidence in the ability of PRC people to adhere to international norms. This procedure is common in most countries, including China.
Well I admit there are many poorly behaved person in PRC, they reduced the reputation of all. But the wish to buy cheap is nothing wrong: Letbox gave the $7 offer, the OP would believe he can find another one the same, it’s normal.
On the contrary, Mainland China Internet companies collect personal information the most, you just give them phone number, they can get all your personal details from government platform.
Most mainland Chinese buy foreign VPS because they don’t want their websites being monitored by the gov. We even believe we have the rights to be anonymous while we obey the rules of TOS/AUP. However, if you put the rule ‘Real identity is strict required’ in TOS, customers didn’t see it, broke it, it’s their fault. (Personal suggestion, to put the rules on the top with red color which you think the most important. Normally, TOS are too long to read it completely.)
For WHMCS’s information fill in, it is an innate form because WHMCS designs that. Personal hosting providers like me (Former business) in China who uses WHMCS may think it’s an useless function at all, I put it there because I don’t know how to turn it off. Some of my friends already designed selling platforms without personal information collection, the only thing clients need to do is to register with their E-mail address and pay money, everyone happy.
BTW, SMS verification may be the most effective way to get rid of Mainland Chinese clients like me. I exit websites immediately when they ask for my phone number, to say nothing of paying money to them.
I know China is obviously very strict on collecting personal information. That first sentence was not meant to be a literal reading.
I understand many Chinese are frustrated by censorship and monitoring. I have helped Chinese friends in China get around these restrictions. However, you need to understand one thing: there is no right to be anonymous anywhere in the world, not even in the US. Their Bill of Rights do not guarantee the right to be anonymous. The reason is because there are legal implications should crimes be committed and the actual person must be traceable.
What is important is the privacy policy that states the extent to which your private information is protected. The requirement for real identity is the same in China or anywhere else, and you as a PRC Chinese knows this, so you should not expect different standards on identity. What you can argue for is strong privacy and non-disclosure standards. Please understand the difference and not enter contracts with international entities using your own beliefs.
Again, I reiterate that how your friends choose to do business is their business (pun unintended). What I think is fair and reasonable is to respect the rules and laws governing providers in other jurisdictions. 随乡入乡是基本的尊重。
随乡入乡 => 入乡随俗
I understand the rule, that’s why I exit hosting business. But the situation is most Chines don’t know and how to let them know (Most still believe ‘Freedom of speech === Anonymous === Privacy’). Besides, aren’t there other ways to do information identification rather then fill in forms? Tracking Paypal account is much easier and accurate by the U.S. GOV when website owner do crimes. I just don’t understand what’s the usage of WHMCS information fill-in totally under self-consciousness, you know information can be fake at all even it ‘looks real’.
I agree that it is a lot neater to rely on PayPal, but that is not how the law operates in most places. You giving fake information is your own problem and you will answer for it if anything happens, but no provider is not going to take the responsibility of answering for you. This is called due diligence. I don't know why you are so defensive about this because it is perfectly logical that people need to do what is necessary to show that they have done their part to prevent abuse and problems.
Thanks for noting the difference in wording of complying with the cultures of others. It has been sometime since I used that phrase and your version is much more accurate.
Yep you gave an accurate interpretation I can understand, appreciate! Providers have to do the process even if they may gain fake information, this can help them on the court. That’s culture difference, Chinese may used to ignore useless process, focus on the result, for best efficiency. Western focus on the justice of the process, even it may reduce productiveness. In another word, we can actually collect personal information without letting customers know, pretend we are anonymous, make them happy. Westerns have to let their customers know ‘We are collecting your information’ and believe they would give their real information, even the process full of mistakes, whatever, based on ‘trusty’. However, I don’t believe in ‘Credit System’ at all, especially when I saw the result of unmanned London subway entrance...
Honestly, I am often in two minds about both types of social norms and cultures. I am ethically Chinese with lots of PRC friends (so I understand quite a lot about PRC norms and cultures) and I totally understand and agree with the part about unproductive and inefficient processes. In my view, the rapid rise of China as a global powerhouse in under 30 years is precisely because of the disdain and disregard for due process. In my work, often I have been frustrated by a lot of these processes and this is why I would like to go to China eventually to further my professional career.
At the same time, having grown up and been schooled in a society whose socio-political-judicial systems have largely been derived from the Anglo-Saxon sphere, I fully appreciate the needs for processes to ensure checks and balances. These processes do help to prevent abuse and injustice. The relative lack of checks and balances in PRC Chinese culture can be quite scary at times. I often like to say that under the PRC Chinese culture, the road to heaven is really fast, but so is the road to hell. Having all these extra processes may seem cumbersome, but they actually provide check points to give more time for consideration of consequences and potentially negative effects.
Ultimately, it is up to each system to determine what is acceptable or unacceptable. I am in no position to judge or decide. I think that 入乡随俗 (thanks for the correction again) is the best middle ground; we should respect and accept the cultural and social norms of the places that we are in, even if they conflict with our own values and belief. Otherwise, one is always welcome to walk away.
Finally, 不打不相识，之前若有冒犯，请你大人不计小人过。
I mentioned disputes as different reason it doesn’t means for who using fake details only and why i forced to accept random words like ( asdfgafdu )as his name? and let me included you with more information what I suffered from.
1 - Don't read our TOS and fully understanding our Terms of use and refund policy with us
2 - feeling that disputes is the right to do i only got disputes from chines.
3 - inpatient even we mentioned our setup time while he order and very clear in the at order form & TOS & very cleat at LET they accept to ignore it for small example i just got someone order this offer and later open ticket asked why his services still pending after 6 hours? even we are mentioned our setup time.
4 - asking for immediately responded even on sales ticket even in weekended
5 - Never care of our maintenance notification then come back and complaining
there is a lot and plenty of reasons so for who against me did you will pay me for those chargebacks to cover my losses?
Submit evidences to Paypal, make their dispute fail, the most effective way.
Ya and wasting more time than i want. Great Idea.
In almost every case, (a) writing off losses on account of bad customers and (b) focusing on new business is more profitable than chasing ghosts of the past.
I think you have to understand the provider's situation in that because he provides a cheap service and his profit margins are thin, he doesn't want to waste time on such actions because his time needs to be used to do things that will earn him money. His time is money!
This is why a lot of the lowend providers blacklist Chinese customers: imagine out of 500 Chinese customers which the provider earns say $1 profit each month, half of them do chargeback after a few months and the provider has to spend time filing 250 disputes with Paypal (and each dispute will require several back and forth correspondence). If I am the provider, of course I rather ban the Chinese customers. It is another thing if the customers are letting me earn $10 bucks each a month. I can consider filing the disputes.