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Inviting LEB Offers - Page 2
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Inviting LEB Offers

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Comments

  • @Jarland's right you know, why worry about what happened over a LEB? Yeah, providers may have lost an hour or so submitting offers, but now it's lesson learned right?

    Look what happened on LET in the same timeframe. Two providers got DDoSed out of existence due to demand for their offers. Another did his best business ever. Look at the poll results - over 80% of respondents bought exclusively from LET. At some point, you have to question whether you're just making LEB submissions for the sake of it.

    You're also never going to get it straight from @jbiloh, the man is a consummate politician; for all the relevancy in his last post, he may as well just have posted 'BANANA!'.

    So, fuck LEB. It's going nowhere, and is being driven there by people with literally no idea what they're doing. You've wasted enough time over the years. Come to LET, engage with your audience, understand them and give them what they want and watch the sales flood in.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider

    I think I have visited leb 4 or 5 times in 2016, I forget it exists most of the time, it started to fade out of existstance a long time ago.

    Shame really, a small budget and a month and I could have it right back on top again, at this stage there are so many obvious wins not being taken advantage of that the only conclusion is that CC does not want to see leb succeed or let become anything more than it is.

    It is what it is, I accepted the only ambition here was to maintain the status quo a long time ago.

    Thanked by 2Lm85H4gFkh3wk3 Riz
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited November 2016

    AnthonySmith said: Shame really, a small budget and a month and I could have it right back on top again, at this stage there are so many obvious wins not being taken advantage of that the only conclusion is that CC does not want to see leb succeed or let become anything more than it is.

    Who's to say it's not on top right now? For a blog posting hosting related offers that isn't just one of those fake review SEO spam sites, I mean. By what comparison can we assume that it was ever greater than it is today other than personal feeling or perception?

    I think what you really mean is you have ideas that could make it more appealing to you. Which is great, feel free to share.

  • @Nekki said:
    So, fuck LEB. It's going nowhere, and is being driven there by people with literally no idea what they're doing. You've wasted enough time over the years. Come to LET, engage with your audience, understand them and give them what they want and watch the sales flood in.

    That's nice and all, but I suspect LEB traffic is far larger than LET. It makes sense for CC to monopolize LEB, but it also makes sense for providers to be upset at being excluded when CC lead them on.

  • HackedServer said:

    That's nice and all, but I suspect LEB traffic is far larger than LET.

    It's not. LET ate LEB's dinner some years ago and nothing has changed in that respect - check towards the 'where did you buy' poll thread to take a look at the (admittedly) rough numbers.

    From the data @Jarland kindly shared earlier today, LET may have peaked at nearly twice the traffic of LEB over the BF/CB period.

  • HackedServerHackedServer Member
    edited November 2016

    @Nekki said:
    It's not. LET ate LEB's dinner some years ago and nothing has changed in that respect - check towards the 'where did you buy' poll thread to take a look at the (admittedly) rough numbers.

    Polling LET members about where they bought from isn't exactly representative of the balance between LET/LEB views. I would honestly say that data means very little.

    From the data @Jarland kindly shared earlier today, LET may have peaked at nearly twice the traffic of LEB over the BF/CB period.

    I'm just now seeing this data, really cool! I don't see any LEB data in his posts though, am I missing it?

    If Alexa is to be trusted (idk if it is), LEB gets twice the unique monthly visitors as LET. I actually expected a bigger gap. That's still a large amount of traffic difference, and people don't go to LEB to chat.

  • HackedServer said:

    Polling LET members about where they bought from isn't exactly representative of the balance between LET/LEB views. I would honestly say that data means very little.

    I'm not looking for a balanced view, I'm trying to find out what LET members did. I'm not really interested in exclusive users of LEB.

    HackedServer said: I'm just now seeing this data, really cool! I don't see any LEB data in his posts though, am I missing it?

    It's a few posts down from the first batch of data, a bit after JB responds with that vague 'mulitple times' statement.

  • @Riz said:
    @jbiloh - why bother asking the community for their time and offerings when nothing except CC offers were posted for BF / CM?

    They want to seem as if they tried despite every offer since the 23rd has used CC's servers or is owned by CC.

    Again CC have free rein but don't intentionally ignore them for the sake of you making money

  • @Nekki said:
    I'm not looking for a balanced view, I'm trying to find out what LET members did. I'm not really interested in exclusive users of LEB.

    Then you can't use it as data to tell a provider where they should focus.

    It's a few posts down from the first batch of data, a bit after JB responds with that vague 'mulitple times' statement.

    I see it now, wow. I take back what I said. That's...shocking.

  • @Nekki said:

    HackedServer said:

    That's nice and all, but I suspect LEB traffic is far larger than LET.

    It's not. LET ate LEB's dinner some years ago and nothing has changed in that respect - check towards the 'where did you buy' poll thread to take a look at the (admittedly) rough numbers.

    From the data @Jarland kindly shared earlier today, LET may have peaked at nearly twice the traffic of LEB over the BF/CB period.

    It was all you and your great threads.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider
    edited November 2016

    jarland said: Who's to say it's not on top right now?

    Common sense, observation of general opinion, and not to forget... raw data.

    There is no point in sharing any more ideas, I just accept this site is what it is now, there is no ambition to take it further.

    I am sure if you had the ability too you would, but that is beyond you as you simply do not have the influence or the access so the criticism is not aimed at you.

    edit: I do not mean 'technical ability' I mean you have to many barriers.

  • HackedServer said: Then you can't use it as data to tell a provider where they should focus.

    I'm suggesting they have something of a captive audience here, with a far simpler route to submission.

    Not saying one is 'better' than the other necessarily, just stating the bleeding obvious really.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @AnthonySmith said:

    jarland said: Who's to say it's not on top right now?

    Common sense, observation of general opinion, and not to forget... raw data.

    There is no point in sharing any more ideas, I just accept this site is what it is now, there is no ambition to take it further.

    I am sure if you had the ability too you would, but that is beyond you as you simply do not have the influence or the access so the criticism is not aimed at you.

    edit: I do not mean 'technical ability' I mean you have to many barriers.

    What raw data? I'm suggesting right now that LEB is larger than it ever was. What evidence is there otherwise? Common sense is just another way of saying "in my opinion" while trying to justify stating it as fact without providing any data. As for access and influence, try me.

    I get the feelings and the sentiment, you know I do. I'm challenging the narrative though. How we feel is not always representative of the facts. It's not unusual to romanticize the past. It's also not unusual to pull raw data and see that it conflicts with the narrative in your head. We don't actually have the raw data though, so I'm proposing that we have no idea what we're talking about if we suggest that the sites are not on top of their game.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider
    edited November 2016

    jarland said: What raw data? I'm suggesting right now that LEB is larger than it ever was. What evidence is there otherwise?

    what do you mean 'what raw data' the raw data I had access too while I was a mod, the raw data that is available going back to 2011 on BSA, the raw data I have as an advertiser on LEB, hell even the alexa data.

    Common sense is based on ... well ok lets not.

    if you really want to get in to it and are prepared to concede if proven wrong as I am then we can, and we can do it in a civil manner, but I am not going to waste time on it if you are going to tow the line.

    If you have not checked the data why do you think it is larger than it ever was, on what metric?

    Also I don't think I romanticize the past, it is not the first time I have been accused of that and I understand why, 2011/2012 even 2013 were great, numbers were up, it was booming, but it failed to evolve and keep with the times, it has stood still.

    The only thing that has changed are the people, with the cluster still not working as it should all these years on and bugs still present for years, it is not unfair to say that the 'technical push' to keep things new and evolving simply does not exist.

    I remember about 3 years ago, one of the many many many 'how can we improve' threads was started, it went on for a LONG time, almost nothing was implemented for the same technical barriers that exist to this day.

    One of the suggestions drew lot of attention and jon loved it, everyone could see the advantages in terms of user experience, traffic generation, traffic relevance and so on, never happened because it would require an already existing plugin to be installed, if even that cant be done when everyone wants it including the owners... there is a problem.

    But you know, I find my self thinking as I type this, it has all been said, actions speak louder than words, and in that regard the silence has been deafening, I used to find it frustrating to see from a business perspective, now I just think it is a shame and don't let it bother me as much, it is just an interesting topic is all.

  • @jarland said:

    What raw data? I'm suggesting right now that LEB is larger than it ever was. What evidence is there otherwise? Common sense is just another way of saying "in my opinion" while trying to justify stating it as fact without providing any data. As for access and influence, try me.

    >

    What do you mean by 'larger'? More traffic/page views/unique visits?

    In the cases of those metrics , I thought it was fairly well established that LEB is currently (BF bump not withstanding) well below its past performance.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @AnthonySmith said:

    jarland said: What raw data? I'm suggesting right now that LEB is larger than it ever was. What evidence is there otherwise?

    what do you mean 'what raw data' the raw data I had access too while I was a mod, the raw data that is available going back to 2011 on BSA, the raw data I have as an advertiser on LEB, hell even the alexa data.

    Common sense is based on ... well ok lets not.

    if you really want to get in to it and are prepared to concede if proven wrong as I am then we can, and we can do it in a civil manner, but I am not going to waste time on it if you are going to tow the line.

    If you have not checked the data why do you think it is larger than it ever was, on what metric?

    Also I don't think I romanticize the past, it is not the first time I have been accused of that and I understand why, 2011/2012 even 2013 were great, numbers were up, it was booming, but it failed to evolve and keep with the times, it has stood still.

    The only thing that has changed are the people, with the cluster still not working as it should all these years on and bugs still present for years, it is not unfair to say that the 'technical push' to keep things new and evolving simply does not exist.

    I remember about 3 years ago, one of the many many many 'how can we improve' threads was started, it went on for a LONG time, almost nothing was implemented for the same technical barriers that exist to this day.

    One of the suggestions drew lot of attention and jon loved it, everyone could see the advantages in terms of user experience, traffic generation, traffic relevance and so on, never happened because it would require an already existing plugin to be installed, if even that cant be done when everyone wants it including the owners... there is a problem.

    But you know, I find my self thinking as I type this, it has all been said, actions speak louder than words, and in that regard the silence has been deafening, I used to find it frustrating to see from a business perspective, now I just think it is a shame and don't let it bother me as much, it is just an interesting topic is all.

    I'm always willing to admit that I'm wrong. I'm not actually saying that factually the sites are doing better now, I'm proposing that they are at the height of their success and have never been better to do one thing: challenge the narrative. If the narrative is supported and my challenge upholds it, great. But I want to make sure we're not all just remembering when our lives were easier and projecting that on to everything else.

    @Nekki said:

    @jarland said:

    What raw data? I'm suggesting right now that LEB is larger than it ever was. What evidence is there otherwise? Common sense is just another way of saying "in my opinion" while trying to justify stating it as fact without providing any data. As for access and influence, try me.

    >

    What do you mean by 'larger'? More traffic/page views/unique visits?

    In the cases of those metrics , I thought it was fairly well established that LEB is currently (BF bump not withstanding) well below its past performance.

    I actually don't see that fully established. I actually suggest that the glory days might have been far lower traffic, a smaller and more intimate community. I think we're falsely equating the old sentiments with success by numbers.

  • @jarland said:

    I actually don't see that fully established. I actually suggest that the glory days might have been far lower traffic, a smaller and more intimate community. I think we're falsely equating the old sentiments with success by numbers.

    I'm going to see if I can get into an old email account where I have a bunch of numbers JB have me a couple of months back. I thought they were pretty conclusive, but I find it hard to believe I've seen data you haven't, so I need to take another look.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @Nekki said:

    @jarland said:

    I actually don't see that fully established. I actually suggest that the glory days might have been far lower traffic, a smaller and more intimate community. I think we're falsely equating the old sentiments with success by numbers.

    I'm going to see if I can get into an old email account where I have a bunch of numbers JB have me a couple of months back. I thought they were pretty conclusive, but I find it hard to believe I've seen data you haven't, so I need to take another look.

    I only have my piwik installation.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider

    jarland said: I'm proposing that they are at the height of their success

    Ok, but based on what?

    jarland said: But I want to make sure we're not all just remembering when our lives were easier and projecting that on to everything else.

    My life certainly was not better back then, I quit my job and started Inception hosting from scratch, things for sure were a lot harder back then.

    This is a business, if you cannot measure it, it is a waste of time, you can call it glory days, nostalgia, romanticism or what ever, the numbers are available and are just as valid as they are today in terms of determining success.

    What I suspect is the case, and this really is just an opinion, people pay anyway, the advert slots are almost always full, revenue is not impacted regardless of site numbers, so why bother to invest.

    I am sure this site is chump change to CC anyway, if it fails it fails, they can always sell it when the tipping point happens.

  • jarland said: I only have my piwik installation.

    Got an email address I can holler at? The data's in a table and I don't think it'll format well in a PM.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @Nekki said:

    jarland said: I only have my piwik installation.

    Got an email address I can holler at? The data's in a table and I don't think it'll format well in a PM.

    [email protected]

    @AnthonySmith said:

    jarland said: I'm proposing that they are at the height of their success

    Ok, but based on what?

    Based on my desire to challenge the narrative. One doesn't need data to propose or suggest, only to state. I've not personally seen the data behind the statements, so I'm suggesting and proposing that the data doesn't fit the narrative. That's me challenging you and others.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider

    Feb 2013:
    260,000 monthly impressions

    November 2016:
    150,000 monthly impressions

    quick one from BSA

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider

    jarland said: Based on my desire to challenge the narrative. One doesn't need data to propose or suggest, only to state. I've not personally seen the data behind the statements, so I'm suggesting and proposing that the data doesn't fit the narrative. That's me challenging you and others.

    No, that sounds like you just had a thought shower.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited November 2016

    @AnthonySmith said:

    jarland said: Based on my desire to challenge the narrative. One doesn't need data to propose or suggest, only to state. I've not personally seen the data behind the statements, so I'm suggesting and proposing that the data doesn't fit the narrative. That's me challenging you and others.

    No, that sounds like you just had a thought shower.

    Is that a problem? I don't understand your reflex to being so defensive when challenged and asked simply to quantify your statements.

  • AlexBarakovAlexBarakov Patron Provider, Veteran

    My buysellads are performing much worse then they were a couple of years ago. It could be realted to the new slots available, though.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider
    edited November 2016

    Sorry I don't intend to come off as defensive.

    The numbers I have seen and that are available and the fact that you questioned the very existence of any statistical data while being in an administrative position to begin with both quantify and contradict my statements and sentiments simultaneously.

    The numbers show a decline in interest and 'usership' I know that is not a word but I am sure you will get what I mean, this is the raw data that I personally feel shows that the site is in decline.

    At the same time I can see with my own eyes that it clearly does not reflect or affect the revenue which is the obvious key metric for any business and admittedly contradicts my sentiment.

    With that contradiction in mind I believe that the aim of any business or business asset is to grow, not simply maintain a status quo, and this is what I find to simply be a shame, the numbers should be going up, not halving, the ability to make effective change and evolve is the stumbling block here (opinion).

    I believe with some actual backbone and interface work the numbers could significantly increase beyond anything that has ever been achieved and as a result remove the previous contradiction by actually increasing revenue.

    Either way, you don't feel the data fits the narrative, I am not sure what to say about that, I don't see it that way and I don't feel there is anything to suggest things are on the up and up, but am open to being wrong about that, I just genuinely don't know what you are basing that on.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member, Patron Provider
    edited November 2016

    AlexBarakov said: My buysellads are performing much worse then they were a couple of years ago. It could be realted to the new slots available, though.

    It is that and the fact that the numbers have halved while the rotation has decreased, but you obviously feel the advert is still worth the revenue it generates as does everyone else.

    In essence you are getting less while paying more because even the lower numbers are justifying the cost of the advert.

    My perspective if I was running things would be that I was letting people down and my aim would be to increase the traffic so you get more exposure as an advertiser while trying to increase the volume of viable real estate on the site.

    Thanks for adding to the narrative, always good to get a current paying customer/advertisers perspective.

  • jbilohjbiloh Administrator, Veteran

    I posted this thread, "Inviting LEB offers" because some weeks ago I cleared through all the old submissions, wrote about 60 (yes, 60) LEB features (which are now scheduled months in advance) and with the submission desk totally clear, asked for more. There was no direct link between this thread and BF or CM. I did, in two instances, ask for suggestions about CM content. That's all.

  • @jbiloh said:

    @Francisco said:

    @jbiloh said:

    @davidgestiondbi said:
    Are we still in many month of delay for an new offer?

    Compelling offers will be posted very quickly.

    Are you setting up another queue/etc for black friday? or is it all a hodge podge?

    Francisco

    We'll be scheduling those in the next week or two. Submit if you're interested.

    This implies the opposite of what you're claiming

    @jbiloh said:
    All existing offer submissions have been responded to. We're looking for more which will be scheduled sometime in December. Submit now! :)

    vpsrus said: Thank you for the appreciation

    You're welcome!

    This also implies offers supplied thus far will be released end-of-November/beginning-of-December

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