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    Chicago, Buffalo, or Los Angeles?
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    Chicago, Buffalo, or Los Angeles?

    seikanseikan Member
    edited April 2013 in General

    Dear network pros, I'm going to develop a new website targeting world-wide visitors. Without using CDN services, which server location is recommended?

    • Chicago, IL
    • Buffalo, NY
    • Los Angeles, CA

    Hobby Projects: DNMin | PingBear

    «1

    Comments

    • HalfEatenPieHalfEatenPie Member
      edited April 2013

      Buffalo, NY: I recommend BuyVM and IPXCore
      Los Angeles, CA: I recommend Hostigation and NodeDeploy

      Edit: Oh which location. Sorry about that.

      Catalyst Host - Pie Approved!
    • It just depends CC in Buffalo has some network issues. It i'snt the best. Chicago would be better if it was Central US, and LA isnt a bad choice, just depends where a lot of your readers are. Depending on your budget I would take a look at http://www.constant.com/cloud/vps/

      They have a wonderful global network

    • jcalebjcaleb Moderator

      Shared webhosting service like HostAligator, your site is only in one node and no CDN right?

    • @jcaleb said: Shared webhosting service like HostAligator, your site is only in one node and no CDN right?

      I'm going to purchase a VPS to host the website. Now is considering the location.

      Hobby Projects: DNMin | PingBear

    • If it's worldwide then Central USA would be the best. This would be Texas / Chicago etc.

      It's a balance between Europe and Asia reach.

      Serving you the best VPS, Web hosting, dedicated servers and more - Cloud Shards | Query Foundry
      We operate the network AS62638 | Available in Syd AU and Dallas, Los Angeles and NYC USA
    • jcalebjcaleb Moderator

      I vote LA

    • Los Angeles

    • bnmklbnmkl Member

      If it's worldwide then Central Europe would be the best. This would be Italy etc.

      It's a balance between USA and Asia reach.

      -

    • @Spencer said: It just depends CC in Buffalo has some network issues.

      What sort of issues are you having?

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @peppr said: LA, Chicago, Buffalo, in that order...

      +1 - Depending on the day Buffalo takes a new route, they're routing customers by the /24 or less, and after their "IPv6" switch upgrade in Buffalo, our network speeds dropped to ~ stalling - 20 KB/s. Took a week to convince them to check their own port / switch, and they claimed it was a "uplink wiring" problem.

      Getting 3M/s max across the US is the "norm" now since they've pretty much removed Level3 from their mix last November. XO was added in Buffalo recently to take care of the bandwidth over-commitment.

      Jon will deny everything, but 20 Kbps -> normal speeds after a XO route pops up isn't random. Traffic routing over BroadbandOne routes popping up (when bandwidth is slow) bouncing back and forth around the US, looks like they're struggling just to make BW commits.

      Return paths? Mostly Cogent - Some Tata, Telia, essentially the cheapest back-hauled routes.

      I.E: Routing in Colorado, the middle of the US? Your path now takes Colorado backhauled to Palo Alto -> SF -> Buffalo. 105 MS from Colorado to Buffalo, 50-55 MS to any of New Jersey.

      Level3 makes up less than 2% of the mix now, so you can tell how the routes were optimized, for cheapest bandwidth.

      When a data center pulls crap like even-odd routing, you know they're in deep.

      Feels pretty much like a bait and switch on the poor sods who have contracts there.

    • @peppr amen to that. I currently live in south-east pennsylvania and I get 70ms to Buffalo. Their crap cogent just takes me every which way. I dont see why hosts are staying there.

    • KrisKris Member

      @Spencer said: I dont see why hosts are staying there.

      Lured into 24 month LTO deals with no SLAs or guarantees about network.

      They could go single-homed Cogent, go off-line for two weeks, and from their "contract" you'd have no recourse against them.

    • Depends on your visitor target. In USA, I prefer LA. Maybe you're interested in another continent?

      "I Always Happy ! The Secret Is, When Something Bad Happens, I Always Yell : Eeee... Macarena !!" :D

    • @budingyun said: Choopa

      [offtopic] every time I hear about that DC I always think "Koopa Choopa" [/offtopic]

      You could keep reading this on a site infamous for its ties to (ahem) one particular organization, or you could check out vpsBoard, which has no such ties and tolerates no bullshit. Your choice.

    • @Kris said: +1 - Depending on the day Buffalo takes a new route, they're routing customers by the /24 or less, and after their "IPv6" switch upgrade in Buffalo, our network speeds dropped to ~ stalling - 20 KB/s. Took a week to convince them to check their own port / switch, and they claimed it was a "uplink wiring" problem.

      I would not be surprised if ColoCrossing deployed IPv6 using Hurricane Electric's BGP tunnels.

      Happy RamNode customer since December 2012, lurking LEB since forever

    • The ColoCrossing Buffalo network consists of Level3, Telia, XO and Cogent and has been exceptional in my experience.

      Your posts do not suggest a very high level of intelligence, by the way, Kris.

    • KrisKris Member

      @mikehighend said: Your posts do not suggest a very high level of intelligence, by the way, Kris.

      Your posts and history suggests you work for VPSCrossing or CVPS.

      You don't need @pubcrawler to see it's obvious based upon your history.

      Regardless, the Buffalo network is complete trash lately, and unless you have your own ASN like Fran, you suffer at ColoCrossing's network admins, and their "routing"

      Check the information at BGP, Level3 is almost completely gome from their network. Stats and having to administrate servers on that piss poor network is solid proof in my opinion.

      By the way - their routing and inability to manage does not suggest a very high level of intelligence.

      See you at the next ColoCrossing related thread.

    • KrisKris Member

      @mikehighend said: The ColoCrossing Buffalo network consists of Level3, Telia, XO and Cogent and has been exceptional in my experience.

      I remember the tickets I sent in that day regarding only being able to push 300 KB/s max, pointing to an over-sold connection... Suddenly things worked and XO was added to the mix.

      Crystal at UGVPS had a lot of network issues and got ColoCrossed until it took ~ almost a week for them to fix her network issues.

      It's not just me. You can insult me all you'd like - I'm no CCNA nor do I claim to be. But from working with shoddy cheap data centers, I know the tell-tale signs.

    • Kris, no one would confuse you for a CCNA.

      Regarding UGVPS I presume you are referring to (http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=1252372&highlight=ugvps), which is clearly not a ColoCrossing issue.

      The more you say, the more you look line a loon who has an axe to grind.

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @mikehighend said: The more you say, the more you look line a loon who has an axe to grind.

      The more you talk (and all of your previous comments) point to you being Chris of ChicagoCrossing.

      Regardless, everything pointed to the same issues. It took a memory and disk check until ColoCrossing checked and realized their switch / "uplink" port was bad, resulting in poor network speeds.

      No axe to grind, but ColoCrossing should be called out on its less than budget routing and re-routing of customers / bringing up backbones (XO as you mentioned) as a fast fix for over-saturated lines.

      We know who you are, and from every single thread / comment you post, you should honestly be defending your own company in the other thread (oh wait, you are in this one)

      Honestly Chris, I liked you better when you stayed on your own username and kept your mouth shut. Hiring Kevin and keeping quiet was the brightest thing you've done in a while.

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      Kris,

      Im right here, nice try though :)

      As for the routing, CVPS, UG, and IPX have had no issues that I know of.

      Seems like your the only one complaining, and honestly Mike is right, you dont seem to know much of what you are talking about.

      That being said, going back to my youtube vids :)

      Regards

      Chris

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @CVPS_Chris said: Im right here, nice try though :)

      Sorry, the IPs were pulled on you last year. Must be a joint account for the crew.

      I wasn't the only one complaining, Hudson Valley Host customers were rather livid at return paths of 20kbps.

      It took CC around 10 traces and me setting up looking glass software for them to do anything.

      One support reply said 'we tested and it was OK over the local network - so no issue" , followed up by "wait - no, we're looking into it"

      Maybe just HVH's paths are screwy, but customers have been flocking left right and center from Buffalo.

      Buffalo = Hotel California location of CC. All others are cages / racks within actual data centers.

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      Kris,

      I wont even address the IP issue as that has already been cleared up.

      As for routes, 0 complaints here, and Buffalo is thriving more than any other location for me. Again, going back to youtube vids since those are more entertaining than your complaints that seem to have lack of knowledge on the situation.

      Regards

      Chris

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @CVPS_Chris said: than your complaints that seem to have lack of knowledge on the situation.

      I dealt with Level 3 tickets and dealing with reasons / trace-routes and helping CC's own network admins with trace-routes. I should've sent them a remote-hands fee.

      Your previous experience was "barbecues are on aisle 5" - So I'm no Einstein, but I'll go up against your uneducated ass any day of the week.

      After weeks of dealing with the customers (who apparently had route issues as well) I'm convinced Jon's doing some budget routing at the expense of networks literally stalling.

      I have weeks of screenshots, tickets and traceroutes if you'd really like go to into this.

      Example of slow / corrupt connection. Buffalo CC -> LA CC

      http://f.cl.ly/items/271S0k282R161E400i00/Screen Shot 2013-04-02 at 2.31.23 AM.png

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Kris said: but I'll go up against your uneducated ass any day of the week.

      How exactly am I uneducated? Please explain that to me as I would like to get a great laugh from the next few words that come out of your mouth.

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member

      @CVPS_Chris said: How exactly am I uneducated? Please explain that to me as I would like to get a great laugh from the next few words that come out of your mouth.

      Weird, as it mostly came from the words that came out of your mouth on this forum.

      Also, the brightest bulbs aren't usually associates at Lowes in their 20's until someone needs a front, I mean CEO for a company.

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Kris said: brightest bulbs aren't usually associates at Lowes in their 20's until someone needs a front, I mean CEO for a company.

      When did I even work at Lowes? And have you attended College and/or have a masters degree?

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member

      From your LinkedIn profile, before CVPS. You sent me an invitation when you sent many clients one awhile ago.

      I graduated cum laude with an Associates in Business. Not fully there, but on my way to a Bachelors.

      You on the other hand...

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Kris,

      Nope, never worked at Lowes my entire life. I have a Bachelors and Masters in Business, so I think I'm two up on you there. Not really sure were you are going with this one, but like Mike said earlier, just keep talking yourself into a corner and looking dumb.

      Its a good look on you.

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @CVPS_Chris said: I have a Bachelors and Masters in Business, so I think I'm two up on you there.

      I highly doubt this, but regardless of your degress - you know nothing about computers. You've shown it time and time again. Stop making this personal you spoiled little kid, as I haven't tried.

      This is about Buffalo's "Premium" network, no need to make things personal - that's something a spoiled little kid from a big house on a cul-de-sac in the same neighborhood Jon grew up in would say.

      PS: Good call on selling that house after the housing crisis, surprised how much Jean got for it.

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Kris,

      Congratulations, you grew up as a social outcast and vent yourself over the internet since its all you can do. This is the most time I have spent on here the past 5 months, and plan to keep a small presence, so this is my last response.

      What my parents do, has nothing to do with anything. Fact of the matter is, I am smarter than you, and will always be more successful. I never grew up in the same neighborhood as Jon, in fact, he grew up in a MUCH different lifestyle than I did, and good for him making it to where he is today.

      Only poor kids that have no sense call other people spoiled. My father worked pretty damn hard to make it where he did, so no one can fault him for that. So I, a goal oriented person such as myself, will follow in his footsteps and make my life just as good or better than his. When you move out of your little hole in the wall apartment, get a real job, then we can talk.

      Goodluck with school, maybe they can try and teach you something once you learn that you are not always right.

      Regards

      Chris

      winning

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member

      @CVPS_Chris said: Congratulations, you grew up as a social outcast and vent yourself over the internet since its all you can do. This is the most time I have spent on here the past 5 months, and plan to keep a small presence, so this is my last response.

      I work on the internet. So I guess all system administrators who call out ColoCrossing on their "optimized" routing is a social outcast. It's been a pleasurable five months, no one has missed you.

      You run a front company and pretend to work on the internet.

      Venting is calling out a provider on an over-sold network.

      Social outcast = starting a little fight and making things personal on the internet because you're:
      a) uneducated
      b) did work at Lowes, as an "Associate" aka stockboy
      c) sticking up for your front / master company.

      Piss off kid, no one thinks your winning since you couldn't even keep up with Prometeus with your big overselling game. You have over-sold, slow performing servers that reboot every other day. Oh and how was that data loss / hack handled? Can't wait till Jeremiah can tell us the truth :)

      Failing

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @CVPS_Chris said: When you move out of your little hole in the wall apartment, get a real job, then we can talk.

      I'm self-employed full time working remotely, and own my own apartment. You meanwhile reside with your parents as of early 2012.

      You're really not too smart, from the fact you went from high school -> Lowes, as a stockboy. Everyone knows it.

      Hell, many got the LinkedIn email, since many fell for your servers at one point.

      No need to hide it. Just shut your face, sit in the corner with your name on the papers, and let Kevin handle PR.

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider
      edited April 2013

      @Kris,

      Since you brought it up again, ****When did I work at Lowes?****,

      Second I just proved I have a higher education than you

      Where is the front? Are my filed taxes fake? Jeremiah was the reason it happened. I put my trust in the wrong person. I dont think he will be showing his face around here.

      Call out ColoCrossing all you want, it wont change anything. It doesnt change the fact that I have seen no issues, IPX has seen no issues, UG has seen no issues. Thats all I pointed out.

      ChicagoVPS is larger than any provider on here ( Minus Burst ). What does Prometeus have to do with anything?

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • FranciscoFrancisco Top Provider

      @CVPS_Chris said: IPX has seen no issues,

      Didn't they just have a power outage today? As did multiple other people a couple months back? Trust me, don't say "it didn't happen", I got sent the flippin' RFO by Jon and I wasn't even hit by it.

      @CVPS_Chris said: UG has seen no issues.

      Yes they did. There was known ATL issues with a bad router/switch that Jon/CC admitted to at one point. Hell, even Kevin said so himself when someone mentioned ATL being blippy for the better part of a week.

      Higher education means little. I'm a college drop out yet I still run an very successful brand & development countless systems that hosts are still trying to copy or bug solusvm to integrate.

      Francisco

      BuyVM - Dedicated KVM Slices / Anycast Support! / Stallion Control Panel / Windows 2008, 2012, & 2016! / Unmetered Bandwidth!
      BuyShared - Shared & Reseller Hosting / cPanel + Softaculous + CloudLinux / Pure SSD! / Free Dedicated IP Address
    • KrisKris Member

      @CVPS_Chris said: ChicagoVPS is larger than any provider on here ( Minus Burst ). What does Prometeus have to do with anything?

      Your large 'winning' signature as if you're special, in anyway.

      Also, sorry, I didn't exactly screenshot your profile at LinkedIn, just found it odd that an "associate" at Lowes moved to web-hosting, it was an odd jump, which is why I remembered it. You looked 22-25 at most, I didn't think a double masters and a Lowes job was possible.

      Again, sorry - I don't have your old LinkedIn profile. I didn't accept the request. Just had a look.

      Saying you have two degrees doesn't prove much, nor does it quite prove your education level. Anyone with an hour of reading your comments would probably be a little skeptical as well.

      I may be dumber than the poor saps who have been suckered in to 24 month LTOs, but when I get reports of network issues, network wide, having to do with slow page loading speeds / getting reports directly from GTMetrix about pages taking 8-10 seconds to load... it's the network.

    • @CVPS_Chris my IPXcore routing in Buffalo is crap

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Fran,

      We are talking about Buffalo and network routing. Non of those issues correspond with either.

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • KrisKris Member

      @CVPS_Chris said: We are talking about Buffalo and network routing. Non of those issues correspond with either.

      Same network switch issues in Buffalo. Same poor network, and same terrible routing.

      Texas routing traffic through BroadbandOne for a few days due to a nLayer issue.

      Stop trying to pretending it's all brilliant at CC, you're just going to get called out by providers and people like myself who've been affected by it.

    • Also @CVPS_Chris what about the odd even routing?

    • KrisKris Member

      @Spencer said: Also @CVPS_Chris what about the odd even routing?

      Or XO popping up mid-network ticket to solve 20 KB/s issues.

      Bandwidth carriers popping up (and like Level3) more quality ones disappear at the drop of a hat.

      Download paths different than return paths, so it looks like your server is fast, until you try to retrive a file from it, get Cogent and ~ 800 Kbps average.

      Should be in a movie, "Every which way but honest"

    • CVPS_ChrisCVPS_Chris Member, Provider

      @Spencer said: @CVPS_Chris my IPXcore routing in Buffalo is crap

      Yet you have services through us. Laugh.

      @Kris said: just found it odd that an "associate" at Lowes moved to web-hosting, it was an odd jump, which is why I remembered it. You looked 22-25 at most, I didn't think a double masters and a Lowes job was possible.

      Actually let me break it down for you. I worked at Kohls, have you never seen someone out of Highschool go to college and work while in College? I sure have.

      To recap. While in College, getting my degree, I worked 5 days a week, ran a hosting company, played a very high level of hockey that I did 7 days a week, and still did well in College.

      Yes I was still employed at Kohls until just a a few month ago working ONE DAY a month. Why you may ask? To keep my discount, I occasionally shop there, whats the big deal?

      Here you are shooting off your mouth with no evidence to support anything.

      ColoCrossing.com - Premier Datacenter and Cloud Solutions for Business

    • FranciscoFrancisco Top Provider
      edited April 2013

      @CVPS_Chris said: @Fran,

      We are talking about Buffalo and network routing. Non of those issues correspond with either.

      You're splitting hairs then. An issue is still an issue :P Trust me, my toes get put to the coals every time I break something.

      Buffalo's routing is screwy but I'm pretty sure my routes don't get tinkered with as much since we run our own ASN/ranges there. I know i've seen some very odd routes and I know all of L3 disappeared. Jon informed me of the reasons behind the changes but I'll keep those to myself. I've had many customers of Buffalo based companies paste me their traceroutes and then they ask me why ours are different. Maybe Jon's giving us a bit of a better setup? Probably not.

      Don't get me wrong, I get a price that Jon likely makes $5/m off me in profit but would we use the location again? Probably not. It's unlikely we'll be racking much more gear over there either and will instead just shove off some to Europe. It's still stable but a lot of that is because Anthony & I planned out the nodes differently than we have in Vegas.

      Francisco

      BuyVM - Dedicated KVM Slices / Anycast Support! / Stallion Control Panel / Windows 2008, 2012, & 2016! / Unmetered Bandwidth!
      BuyShared - Shared & Reseller Hosting / cPanel + Softaculous + CloudLinux / Pure SSD! / Free Dedicated IP Address
    • It wasn't Lowes, it was Kohls. Until earlier this year, according to your LinkedIN.

      Stop being an asshole to people and people will like you more.

      vpsBoard.com - Now with over 450 members! A friendly community with active discussion. Come join us!

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    • @CVPS_Chris said: Yet you have services through us. Laugh.

      I actually don't, hence why I cancelled. But good attempt at being a douche. Stand up man we have right here

    • KrisKris Member

      @CVPS_Chris said: Here you are shooting off your mouth with no evidence to support anything.

      Sorry. Stockboy at Kohls. If you really got a degree, good on you! I guess that explains your lack of being able to handle client issues, at least something useful was being done.

      My evidence was pretty clear? You did work as a stockboy at Kohls before CVPS, all I claimed - which I seemed was an odd jump.

      So sorry I got the name wrong.

    • I can't comment on the network, but adding XO . . . no you're not going for a "quality" mix. Quite frankly I'm not sure what you would be going for with XO. Last time I checked their pricing wasn't all that great . . and the network was still, for the most part, hot potato garbage.

    • KrisKris Member
      edited April 2013

      @Microlinux said: I can't comment on the network, but adding XO . . . no you're not going for a "quality" mix. Quite frankly I'm not sure what you would be going for with XO. Last time I checked their pricing wasn't all that great . . and the network was still, for the most part, hot potato garbage.

      It solved the fact their network couldn't push more than .05 Mbps (to their other networks, so no need to point it to another network)

      People running from a fire could describe the state of the Buffalo network in terms of quality.

      It's a poor quality company, but less than their return path of mostly over-sold Cogent (at least it was last week, it looks like 2 Cogent connections / inbound paths are present now... Maybe they got another Gig line

      Level3 is less than 2% of the mix and on par with the amount of data that all of @Francisco nodes push.

      I'd stop defending a terrible network when you don't know much about anything when it comes to systems, let alone routing.

      @CVPS_Chris said: Call out ColoCrossing all you want, it wont change anything. It doesnt change the fact that I have seen no issues

      It's pretty easy not to see any issues when you aren't hands on with the equipment or systems (for the best)

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