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Need help for starting hosting business

SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran
edited January 2013 in Help

Hi,

I am a coder and gradually I have few clients to those I am providing coding to hosting / domain everything. I think now it is time I should start my own hosting business properly as for me it is now a mess to manage them without using proper billing software as well site. I feel if I have a proper hosting site, current client may use my other hosting offer which otherwise I tell them if they ask for.

I want to do following:
1. Offer shared hosting (cpanel based)
2. Offer VPS on my site
3. Offer dedicated server

Obviously I will only resale in beginning but for shared hosting I will either use VPS or a Dedicated box.

Currently I use own few dedicated server and some VPS (thanks to LEB , after coming to this place I started using VPS). I am fine with all providers I use and even using some from 5 years or more.

So here are my doubts..
1. Should I host my own site on dedicated box or on a VPS ..(which will also host billing software)
2. Which billing software should I use (considering hostbill owned license)
3. What are the ways that my clients can't get information about parent company (through IP whois etc.)
4. Which will be best.. VPS or dedicated box for offering shared hosting (since it will take a little while to get in profits so want to avoid any non-justified expenses).
5. Should I host clients of site on that dedicated box where I host my own site (won't it be security issue incase of client's site get compromised due to outdated script etc. (and that pretty common)).

Also, what service you suggest for reselling dedicated box ( I have already decided for VPS service).

«1

Comments

    1. different vps for you billing system. off site.
    2. If you have the money start with a nice size vps with 2-4 gb of memory and a copy of cpanel
    3. buy straight from the DC so It only give the DC information for arin lookup.
    4. vps is just fine
    5. seperate boxes.
    1. You should, practically, host the site away from your nodes, incase something goes sour and you need to send out a mass e-mail to your clients.

    2. Hostbill / WHMCS would suffice nicely, feel free to use others like BoxBilling etc.

    3. Lots of resellers offer 'white-hat' or 'unbranded' so you can setup your own DNS settings etc instead of using theirs, keep whois public to get a reputation of greatness here :).

    4. LoveVPS offer a cPanel, WHMCS and a decent KVM/OVZ offer in Florida which would cover everything, for something like $30/month, last time I checked anyway. I'd host Shared-Hosting through a reseller or on a VPS where you can easially upgrade, so look for OVZ. Dedicated box isnt needed until you've got a need for it.

    5. Like I've already mentioned, keep your own stuff away from your customers stuff, you're right, security issues / script abuse can sometims elevate access and/or delete your stuffs.

  • SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    So, at first I should setup my site on reliable VPS which is "unbranded" and host billing software on it along with main site and keep it away from all other things.. My current VPS providers are good but unfortunately they own IP block so whois always shows their name. I guess I have to hunt for one..

    What about dedicated server reseller, what are preferred DC those sell on good price irrespective of volume ?

  • shovenoseshovenose Member, Host Rep

    Well, keep in mind that cPanel is cheaper on a VPS than on a dedicated server $14.95 vs $34.95, so start out with a VPS.
    you can use WHMCS or HostBill, both are good.
    For hosting your VPS customers you could join BurstNet reseller program or something similar where you just set up a server on their infrastructure rather than managing your own. However, getting a dedicated server with Xeon e3, 16gb ram, and 4x disks in raid10 will get you the best performance and be more profitable, providing you can fill it up and charge more than just $7/month...
    For your own site, it is recommended to put it on its own VPS. You might consider a DigitalOcean server for $5/mo for this purpose you will also need to set up one for your SolusVM master if you do decide to go the rout eof setting up your own VPS infrastructure.
    For dedicated servers just resell them. For example at UnmanagedServers.NET we have a program where you can sell our dedicated servers (and VPS too should you want to) where we offer 15% discount for resellers.
    Hope it helps!

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    Reasonably, IP blocks aren't going to show your name. You can have it done but honestly it's just not worth the process for a single IP in my opinion. You'll never be truly hidden as a reseller. Even with your name on it, someone knows what provider has that block.

    I recommend a managed cpanel vps for shared hosting. That or unmanaged with a management company. It's like having employees to watch your back at nearly no cost ;)

  • shovenoseshovenose Member, Host Rep

    Yeah I did not mention that.
    Even when your provider "swips" the ip (I believe that's what it's called) it will still say the name of your datacenter or provider if you go to like whoishostingthis.com

  • SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran

    I don't want to show my name on IP, I simply want to use anonymous IP.. surprisingly I found that burst.net VPS are directly in the name of datacenter , other than that almost all here have their name in simple IP whois details.

    What if I buy dedicated box and run few VPS on it along with my main site VPS ?

  • Nope seperate them, different datacenters. That way when 1 goes down you don't lose you support system.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    I run my site off one of our nodes. DNS hosted outside, email through google. Some see it as irresponsible, I see it as saying I believe in my product so much that if you go down, I'm going with you. There's always twitter and email. If my product suffers, I want my marketing to suffer equally.

    I guess personal philosophy comes into play. But yeah it's generally looked down on.

  • We host our main site on our box, but we host our billing offsite to keep support up in case of an outage.

  • @jarland said: I run my site off one of our nodes. DNS hosted outside, email through google. Some see it as irresponsible, I see it as saying I believe in my product so much that if you go down, I'm going with you. There's always twitter and email. If my product suffers, I want my

    marketing to suffer equally.

    Same here and couldn't have put it better myself.

  • PacketVMPacketVM Member, Host Rep
    Need help for starting hosting business

    That answers everything, anyhow...

    1. If it's only a website, I would host it on a small (256MB-512MB) LEB or a VPS on your own nodes.

    2. I would recommend WHMCS due to it's simplicity and reasonable support availibility. I would recommend getting a license through LicensePal (for monthly) or WHMCS (for owned)

    3. Set up your own DNS settings through a providers white-label control panel. Take a look at DNSMadeEasy.

    4. You could start off with a VPS (with a cPanel license from LicensePal), and then as you grow expand to a dedicated server. If you want to start with a dedicated server so there is lots of room for expansion, then so be it.

    5. Up to you. Lots of providers host their site on their own nodes and there is nothing wrong with that. Personally, I just use an LEB (from CloudShards) for my website and all licensing is done through LicensePal, SSL's from GoGetSSL = win.

    Hope this helps!! :)

  • All our Internal things get pounded, so we have to use JavaPipe. Kinda sucks but thats life.

    Planning to ship a server to switzerland, 10Gbit protection and we can GRE IPs, it'll cut costs and low latency to both US and UK.

    Twitter is what I use these days for updates, quite addictive.

  • SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran

    I am thankful to all who shared their views, I have been doing my research also. It is certainly important that your main site including support should remain up always. However, idea of hosting billing on another node / place is also good but I just don't get why not to host billing and main site on same server ? Is it that main site may get DDOS etc then billing (being on another server) will not get affected ?

    Also, is there way to replicate your main site and billing site across two or more data center so that if one goes down, other one is available (just a thought as I feel community here is helping and I guess can earn good knowledge form here).

    I am well-versed with linux but only for things I need, so I guess for startup I can do basic to little advance server management.

    So, now I need to decide billing / support system (WHMCMS is suggested everywhere) and I will go with owned license. Now I need place to host my site which is anonymous and is reliable enough. I am seriously considering buying a dedicated box but lets see.

  • @Saahib said: Also, is there way to replicate your main site and billing site across two or more data center so that if one goes down, other one is available (just a thought as I feel community here is helping and I guess can earn good knowledge form here).

    Clustering / replication + anycast

  • AlexBarakovAlexBarakov Patron Provider, Veteran

    @Jacob said: Planning to ship a server to switzerland, 10Gbit protection and we can GRE IPs, it'll cut costs and low latency to both US and UK.

    Don't plan it. That switzerland provider has refused working with anyone that would GRE traffic for anything that is not hosted on the actual server and stopped responding. They are really quick sometimes (in the past), now it is a pain int he ass to get in touch with them. @Zen can confirm my words.

  • Mhm, that's a bummer. :|

    @Alex_LiquidHost said: Don't plan it. That switzerland provider has refused working with anyone that would GRE traffic for anything that is not hosted on the actual server and stopped responding. They are really quick sometimes (in the past), now it is a pain int he ass to get in touch with them. @Zen can confirm my words.

    >

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @Zen said: Main site + billing goes down > You can't take care of already existing clients

    I disagree. If your clients don't know how to get an update outside of your website, you're not effectively communicating with your clients. Plus if your node is down, a ticket isn't going to help you unless your provider honestly doesn't know it's down, in which case you've got bigger issues.

    It's all a matter of how you conduct your business. If it's a major issue, switching an A record isn't hard, and if you don't have backups then you've got yet another larger issue.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    @Zen said: I would consider losing my primary means of contact with my clients to be unacceptable

    E-mail? Well you didn't list that, which of course shouldn't be hosted in such a place :P

    But yeah, e-mail is typically a primary means of contact. Doesn't take long to fire up an e-mail. If they don't check their e-mail, they must not be too concerned. Anyway just sharing my unpopular view for contrast.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    @Zen said: You shouldn't be using the fact that the client 'can' contact you via other means as an excuse to potentially inconvenience them.

    @jarland said: But yeah, e-mail is typically a primary means of contact. Doesn't take long to fire up an e-mail. If they don't check their e-mail, they must not be too concerned.

    Just sharing my difference in philosophy for contrast. If their service is down, sending them an e-mail that I'm working on it is sufficient. There is literally 0 back and forth interaction that we can benefit from until I'm done. Their ticket will go unanswered if I've e-mailed them. They should be checking their e-mail if they are concerned about their service anyway. To say that I should provide any and all venues at all times is really just a matter of preference. If I provided phone support I'd turn off my phone, because talking to them about it is worse for them while I'm working on it. It slows me down and that effects more than just the one I'm talking to.

    Edit: To expand on this a little bit. You don't really do what I do out of laziness or it backfires. This, like the more popular choice, has it's share of work with it. You need to maintain backups and you always need a plan B. Every option requires these, this one is more likely to burn you at the worst time if you're lazy. For me, the benefit of the choice was that literally anywhere else I could host my site I wouldn't trust to the degree that I trust the node that it sits on. No matter how many VPS providers around here I use, there is not a single rack that I would prefer to sit in than the one I am in. Another dedicated in that rack that isn't for clients is a bit out of budget at the moment.

    Someone starting out needs to think these kinds of things through very carefully. Because hosting your site off of your node is not a safety net if done lazily, and I suspect that it often is. My biggest fear is people who host their billing with another unmanaged host and don't make backups. Obviously I can't point a finger to anyone there and I wouldn't even imply that anyone in particular does. But given what we know about people, it's a reasonable assumption that at least a few do.

  • @jarland

    1. stuff goes down
    2. you bulk e-mail everybody to be patient while you are working on it
    3. support is down so no annoying "MY VPS IS DOWN, OMGPGNDIGNDIN" tickets = win

    keep your website distributed though, with a twitter widget or blog thing for people (like me) who first look on the website's social media before my email, hehe

  • One word: twitter

  • Courage.

  • Thanks for everybody's honesty here, I already learned some stuff just by reading this.
    Like -> gogetssl - looks very nice.

  • SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    Alright, thats been a lot of education and I am thankful to all.

    Seems to that now I need to look for 2 VPS (1 for billing and one for main site) but from someone "WHITE HAT" provider.

    I guess, in any case, it will be lots of resource going waste, though main site could 256mb without any CP and then billing site 512MB (I guess WHMCMS can run fine on that)..

    Now for providing hosting services, I need one more VPS (again whitehat).. or can buy a cheap dedicated box..

    Now one more thing I need is backup .. I don't want to find myself in trouble if anything crashes, so need a backup server too..

    So, it will be like :
    Billing software $$$ (owned) + Vps256mb + VPS512mb + real selling vps + cPanel license

    That will be start up cost .. along with whmcms one time cost!

    Not to forget, designing / developing my main site..

  • @Saahib said: Vps256mb + VPS512mb + real selling vps + cPanel license

    You can probably run the main site on a 128MB VPS to start with on nginx. However, if you do anticipate a lot of growth then go with 256MB. 512MB would be more than enough for something like WHMCS.

    @Saahib said: cPanel license

    I'd suggest also investing in things like RVSiteBuilder and Softaculous (or similar software) and you'll need licenses for those.

  • really if you want to be setup perfectly you need:
    3x256mb servers(1 for website,2 geographically seperate name servers)
    1x512mb server for whmcs
    1 2gb+ vps with cpanel (managed if your not someone who is good with linux)

  • shovenoseshovenose Member, Host Rep

    Here's what I would do in your situation personally:
    1x DigitalOcean $5 VPS for WHMCS. Just do what I did design your entire site in WHMCS to make life just a little bit easier.
    2x DigitalOcean $5 VPS (one in each location) for cPanel DNS Cluster.
    1x

  • SaahibSaahib Host Rep, Veteran
    edited January 2013

    I am comfortable managing linux boxes as its been more than 5 years managing them for clients . And I guess I can nicely skin WHMCMS as its using smarty and have done some project on smarty too (though I prefer php based templating) .. I will look into the root of using WHMCMS as whole site but then separating billing and main site could be issue.

    For dns, I have decided to use distributed DNS service provided along with my domain .. quite reliable using from many years. So, issue remain for backup... :)

    Btw, are they (digital ocean) provide white hat boxes ?

    Also, don't you think at start, I should cap recurring expenses to minimum !!

  • shovenoseshovenose Member, Host Rep

    I think you need white label not white hat :)

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