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What's considered as abuse on a leb vps?
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What's considered as abuse on a leb vps?

skirtTightskirtTight Member
edited December 2012 in General

I use 70-90% of my ram allocated to me, and take around 20-30% of the cpu usage allocated to me.

What would be generally considered abuse? I personally don't wish to be a bad client, and when I choose a provider I actually want to stay with them for quite a while.

If they offer me for example, 4 shared cores, would using 20% of their cpu (constantly @ 20%, I almost never fluctuates[add/take 5%]) be considered abuse? Or say, even 40% w/e, is that considered abuse?

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Comments

  • High loads like running UnixBench constantly because of your OCD is a good way to get kicked out of a hosting provider

  • InfinityInfinity Member, Host Rep

    Depends on the provider. Should really be in the AUP.

  • DamianDamian Member
    edited December 2012

    Indeed, ask the provider what their definition of abuse is. You should be able to use all of the ram allocated to you (because it's been allocated to you, and you're paying for it....), but they should have some kind of statement on CPU usage.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @skirtTight said: I use 70-90% of my ram allocated to me, and take around 20-30% of the cpu usage allocated to me.

    It's hard to say exactly, but what you just described is not abusive in my opinion.

    @Infinity said: Depends on the provider. Should really be in the AUP.

    I try to stay vague, because "abuse" is relative. If you overly define it, you can regret it later. With that said, if you're going to vaguely define it, you need to be considerate to your clients. For example, if it isn't destroying the node performance, don't suspend, initiate conversation.

  • RAM allocated - 100% use - No problem
    CPU allocated - 40-50% of your allocation should not be a problem, They will always clock you lower or keep ur priority lower.
    IO allocated - One of the most big bottlenecks, You should not do high IO all the time. It really affects others

  • @darknessends are you speaking as a provider when you say "should not be a problem" or this is based on your experience with multiple vps providers or more how you think it should be? I guess I'm asking for context :)

  • @darknessends said: CPU allocated - 40-50% of your allocation should not be a problem, They will always clock you lower or keep ur priority lower.

    Thank you, this is waht I needed.

    my i/o = low

  • Experience on both. And yes it highly depends upon how oversold the VPS provider is, the more oversold, the more the frequency of such incidents which will impact other VMs

  • MaouniqueMaounique Host Rep, Veteran

    CPU and IO can be abused.
    I usually dont even look at it unless the node suffers, then I look who is abusing. Usually, it means someone using 80%+ IOPS on the node and it is almost always some runaway script or memory leak forcing usage of swap and things like those.
    If it is impossible to allow more time since the abuser is heavily affecting the node, I first try to restart the machine and keep it under observation. In most cases that solves the problem, if it doesnt, I try limiting IO if it still doesnt work, I shut it down.
    In all cases, I inform the owner.
    Regarding CPU, throttling works, so no shutdown is needed, it is also usually a sign of something gone wrong, some mysql, php, gone bezerk. It may mean DDoS attacks, both outgoing and incoming, hacking etc.
    Suspension for abuse only takes place if the shutdown machine has been brought back and abuse continues for hours, we have ppl running desktops in 128 MB and the flash plugin is really-really heavy and they were never suspended even if the load is high.
    We dont offer those anymore, except for customers in good standing which can justify a suitable usage for them.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @Maounique said: Regarding CPU, throttling works

    "CPU Limit" is an amazing little application.

  • @jarland said: "CPU Limit" is an amazing little application.

    To be honest I like getting cpu limited so I don't bring problems.

    Does anyone know of a provider that would let me rape cpu allocated to me? Like edis's kvm setups.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited December 2012

    @skirtTight said: Does anyone know of a provider that would let me rape cpu allocated to me?

    If your allotment was 1 core I'd probably say have at it, but ultimately, preferably, not 365 days a year.

  • Allocated or available? Two very different words.

    Allocated = all yours. Use them to 100% if you like. Stuff like Ram, drive space, transfer etc. Maybe CPU if the provider gives you dedicated cores. You won't find dedicated cores on a LEB though.

    Available = stuff that's burstable. Useable, but not all yours. This is what can be abused. Drive IO, non-dedicated CPU, etc. Stuff that, if you use more than your fair share for too long, it'll affect others on the node.

    Different providers will have different definitions of abuse, and different nodes will have different patterns of use from the other users. Perhaps abuse on one node would be fine on another. Providers should be managing people and spreading loads, but not all do.

    To be honest, you're at least aware of others on the node. Actual abusers tend to be ignorant or just don't care. If your current usage pattern hasn't made the provider complain, assume they can handle it. If they moan, throttle things back a bit.

  • @jarland said: If your allotment was 1 core I'd probably say have at it, but ultimately, preferably, not 365 days a year.

    this, I wouldn't mind getting capped to a single core, it's just that I use some of my boxes really hard, like having angry sex.

    @Gary said: To be honest, you're at least aware of others on the node. Actual abusers tend to be ignorant or just don't care. If your current usage pattern hasn't made the provider complain, assume they can handle it. If they moan, throttle things back a bit.

    Yeah, I really don't want to get anyone angr, or become an abuser, so far the best option I've found would be amazon's ec2 but other than that I don't see many options.

  • @skirtTight
    I used multiple vps-s for torrenting and encoding video. In lowend vps-s i had encodes that was running for 16+hours. The main thing i do (and believe me, never ever a vps provider had any complaints on me /the below example is before i started to use cpulimit/) is to seriously limit the connecting peers on upload and download (also limit the speed to something like 10mbit) and use cpulimit on encodes. I usually set it to 60-70% becuause i use a web interface for my projects so cpu won't overload.
    I usually set the percent like this: set it to x percent (let it be 70) then check the cpu usage in solusvm. If that doesn't differ from command line percentage, then i let it be the way it is. If it is higher in solusvm, i lower it.

    But yeah, kinda hard to know the limits, and i don't like to ask the provider for it. I only asked the provider once in my lifetime, they seriously overthrottled... then they kicked me because they said that limiting my account needs too much of cpu on their side (it was a wjunction host, and i think a big bullshit... with a 20$/month provider, they didn't allow ffmpeg, while torrentflux and all the rest of the s**t was all okay)... it wasn't nice from them, 'couse i even asked for it if i could use the vps for encodes, would they throttle me if i ask them. They said: no problem.

    Since then i don't care. Pay monthly, set speed limit to 1500/2000 kb/s and cpulimit to 70%, and lets rock.

  • @skirtTight said: Yeah, I really don't want to get anyone angr, or become an abuser, so far the best option I've found would be amazon's ec2 but other than that I don't see many options.

    How about a small dedicated server, like Kimsufi?

  • skirtTightskirtTight Member
    edited December 2012

    @ElliotJ said: How about a small dedicated server, like Kimsufi?

    Just turned 18, haven't obtained official credentials because I lost some papers, so I'll eventually get them within 2 months~ I hope.
    And ovh asks me for my credentials : |

    @mahjong said: encoding video.

    That's exactly what I want another vps for :>

    Does anyone know if hetzner asks for credentials?

  • iolimit is also your friend

  • MaouniqueMaounique Host Rep, Veteran

    If you want to encode video you would go better with hetzner they have old Athlon servers that would do a good job for the money. OVH network is better in my view, tho.
    From what I know, Hetzner is more liberal regarding papers, tho I didnt manage to buy anything from any, however, I am from romania so this might be a big part of the reason why.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited December 2012

    Dual L5420 does awesome encoding by the way. Commercial media, great choice for that as well.

    At least I think that's what it was...the $40 one.

  • KuJoeKuJoe Member, Host Rep

    If it's impacting other users, it's abuse.

  • @skirtTight said: Does anyone know if hetzner asks for credentials?

    Yes Hetzner does ask for credentials.

  • @5n1p said: Yes Hetzner does ask for credentials.

    As in an official id? I don't mind giving away my cc info or my cellphone/address to them but I lack an id.

  • @Damian said: Indeed, ask the provider what their definition of abuse is. You should be able to use all of the ram allocated to you (because it's been allocated to you, and you're paying for it....), but they should have some kind of statement on CPU usage.

    and may disk usage too :) I have seen few provider kick client because abuse disk usage

  • @skirtTight said: As in an official id? I don't mind giving away my cc info or my cellphone/address to them but I lack an id.

    When i registered there i posted my passport, not sure but think you can send any document with you picture, driver license or personal card.

  • @5n1p said: When i registered there i posted my passport, not sure but think you can send any document with you picture, driver license or personal card.

    that fixes everything :>

  • Hetzner accept any Photo ID (Had a server there before)

  • @skirtTight said: I use 70-90% of my ram allocated to me, and take around 20-30% of the cpu usage allocated to me.

    Why would this be abuse?

  • Because of "fair" usage policies.

  • kbeeziekbeezie Member
    edited December 2012

    @gubbyte said: @skirtTight said: I use 70-90% of my ram allocated to me, and take around 20-30% of the cpu usage allocated to me.

    Why would this be abuse?

    I would be wondering the same thing on a virtual private server, if you're allocated 1GB you should be able to use that 1GB fully (as I say, free ram is wasted ram). CPU and I/O may be a different matter if you're doing something specifically enough that it would cause issues with neighboring customers.

    But then if we're talking bout LEB VPSes, I imagine some are oversold, and as such those particular providers probably don't like it when you actually try to use what you pay for.

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