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PI IP address space
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PI IP address space

gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep
edited May 2012 in General

Hi

I'm looking for a PI IPv4 address space.
Any ideas how can I get it? OK, I know how, but I mean cheap :)

Comments

  • jhjh Member

    How cheap do you need it?

  • nabonabo Member
    edited May 2012

    Just fill out the form: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-490 See here why you won't find any other possibility to get PI afaik

  • rds100rds100 Member

    First you need to sign a contract with a "sponsoring LIR".
    Second you need to fill out the PI request form.
    Third you need to give your company registration papers (i.e. extract from the trade register or certificate of good stanging, etc.).
    Fourth the LIR needs to send the contact, your company registration papers and the PI request form to RIPE.
    Then wait a few days - if everything is OK with the documents your PI block will be issued shortly.

  • prometeusprometeus Member, Host Rep

    @rds100 said: Second you need to fill out the PI request form.

    This is the hard part as you need to justify 80% of usage in a three months period from the assignment ;-)

  • rds100rds100 Member
    edited May 2012

    @prometeus i think this is not the case anymore for PI:


    6.10 Provider Independent IPv4 Assignments for Multihoming The RIPE NCC will assign additional IPv4 addresses to an End User in order to make the
    assignment size a multiple of a /24 if an End User demonstrates: the need for Provider Independent (PI) IPv4 address space; and the intent to announce this address space for the purpose of multihoming to two or more Autonomous Systems which the End User does not own or control. Cumulatively, no more than 255 additional IPv4 addresses may be assigned to any
    particular End User for the purposes outlined above

    From here

    I.e. justify /30 PI if you want, request it, RIPE should round it to a /24

  • prometeusprometeus Member, Host Rep

    @rds100 said: I.e. justify /30 PI if you want, request it, RIPE should round it to a /24

    I have some dubt that an IPRA will pass such request easily but who know? :-D

  • prometeusprometeus Member, Host Rep

    @gbshouse said: Any ideas how can I get it? OK, I know how, but I mean cheap :)

    What do you mean cheap here? and how many addresses? one /24?

  • jhjh Member

    @rds100 said: I.e. justify /30 PI if you want, request it, RIPE should round it to a /24

    I don't think this is correct.

    A /24 is the smallest sub-assignment and to get one you'll have to justify a /25 immediately.

  • rds100rds100 Member

    OK, I don't want to argue - English is not my native language, i may be reading this incorrectly.
    Try to read the document yourself and see what you can make out of it.
    http://www.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-530
    Section 6.10

    Thanked by 1MrAndroid
  • @rds100 said: OK, I don't want to argue - English is not my native language, i may be reading this incorrectly.

    Try to read the document yourself and see what you can make out of it.

    I would of thought Ripe offered documents in multiple languages.

  • rds100rds100 Member
    edited May 2012

    OK, just two more things to read:
    http://www.ripe.net/ripe/policies/proposals/2006-05
    https://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/address-policy-wg/2011-October/006393.html

    The policy for assigning PI ipv4 was changed after 27th of October 2011.

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    If you want, we can register PI for you (I'm sure rds100 and a few others here can do it too).

    By RIPE we need to charge 50EUR+ per Year and 50EUR+ setup.
    I usualy do 100EUR setup (non refundable, since we don't get it back from RIPE when your application is declined) + 100EUR setup on delivery + 150EUR yearly.
    All +20% VAT if you are in the EU.

    Do note that you can only register PI when you are a company or sole trader with license, RIPE wants to see documents for this and WILL check them completely with your authorities.
    You also need to sign documents, and provide a lot of contact details.
    Getting anything larger than a /21 is also impossible now, they will simply tell you to become a LIR.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2012

    Thanks for comments. I need just few addresses to setup few additional servers around the globe, but to do it I need PI address space (/24 sic!). Not sure what to do with the rest of addresses. I found only one provider which has prices on his website - 250GBP setup + 70GBP yearly for IPv4 and 200GBP setup + 70 GBP yearly for IPv6.
    Strange that it's not possible to assign PI space smaller that /24, for me /28 or /29 would be enough.

    @William - is there any official document which states what kind of documents is required and is it necessary to run business? In Ireland you can run business without any special papers, it's enough to inform Revenue (Irish Tax office) that you are starting business as a sole trader.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    @William - I know, I've mailed you few days ago, but sill looking for cheapest oportunity

  • HC_RoHC_Ro Member
    edited May 2012

    @gbshouse said: Strange that it's not possible to assign PI space smaller that /24

    I'm not a guru when it comes to this but a assignment smaller than a /24 is likely isps wont accept it.. correct?

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    @gbshouse said: @William - is there any official document which states what kind of documents is required and is it necessary to run business? In Ireland you can run business without any special papers, it's enough to inform Revenue (Irish Tax office) that you are starting business as a sole trader.

    No, since it depends on the case but usualy anything official is enough - what you mean is a "sole trader" which is ok too, but you are named personally in the IPs then.
    (Firstname Lastname trading as "Businessname")

    DONT FORGET THAT YOU NEED AN ISP THAT ANNOUNCES YOUR IPS FOR YOU AND ROUTES THEM - NOT MANY DO THAT FOR DEDICATED/VPS CUSTOMERS

    @gbshouse said: @William - I know, I've mailed you few days ago, but sill looking for cheapest oportunity

    Oh you were that, i think i told you higher prices in the ticket - send me an email again to [email protected] and i can make a VERY cheap offer since i'd like to try to register PI for a customer out of personal interest.

    @HC_Ro said: I'm not a guru when it comes to this but a assignment smaller than a /24 is likely isps wont accept it.. correct?

    Correct, anything smaller than a /24 is not routeable globally.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    One of our business partners is able to announce our PI space in at least 11 locations but it requires /24 PI space. For me it's waisting of IP addresses.
    Another question which comes to my mind is that if I need IPs from two different C classes (for DNS usage) is it possible to assign PI with two partial classes?

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited May 2012

    Ahm, you can't route PI at more than one location at the same time - This is NOT anycast space.
    Anycast space is ONLY assigned to TLD providers (.at, .co.uk etc.).

    @gbshouse said: Another question which comes to my mind is that if I need IPs from two different C classes (for DNS usage) is it possible to assign PI with two partial classes?

    No.
    I think you don't really know what PI is and why you want it....

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2012

    @William - I know what PI is, I spoke with sales rep from one of global cloud providers and they are ready to setup routing for my PI (confirmed by their tech. dep.).
    Beside I'm not thinking about anycast, it's rather large multihoming.

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    I doubt THEY know how PI works then - As said: This is NOT anycast space, what you plan to do will break their routing and be a NIGHTMARE for anyone trying to reach your services.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    Beside I'm not thinking about anycast, it's rather large multihoming.
    Mentioned provider is Host Virtual, take a look on their looking glass page (http://www.vr.org/lg/) to fetch IP/AS info. From my experience with them it looks like they know what to do.

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    Yea i know VR (i am customer aswell) - the problem is you CANT multihome a /24 across multiple locations without problems.
    It works, technically, but it will result in massive problems for all.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    They offered me nice SLA so it will be their problem not my, beside that we have redundant env. available already :) For example multihoming of /24 is very popular in many financial institutions (I know few setups from my own experience)

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    @gbshouse said: For example multihoming of /24 is very popular in many financial institutions (I know few setups from my own experience)

    Yes.
    At ONE location, this is SPECIFICALLY for what PI was created.
    Not at multiple.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2012

    It's not limited to ONE location - it all depends how you do things behind your router :)
    Take a look on http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1546.html - I know it's old but most of the solutions are still in use
    Beside that you can use multiple (redundant) routers for single ASN peering with multiple ISPs and still use multihoming - just scale it out to country or even continent level

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited May 2012

    No, as i said before - ANYCAST, which is what you linked, needs ANYCAST space - not PI.
    There is a reason why all RIRs have SPECIAL space for anycast usage - with PI you get into a routing nightmare.

    http://www.ripe.net/ripe/docs/anycast-request-support.html

    The ASN doesn't matter, ASns can be used anywhere - IP space smaller than a /24 not.
    You can do anycast with PI/PA and a LOT of VPN tunneling and weird hacks but as it is normal unicast space this will give routing issues to 90% of the users.

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    @William - scenario which I described is not ANYCAST but MULTIHOMING - you are still using one ASN as a target (but it's handled by multiple physical routers which can be located it two different locations connected for ex. with private fiber) and multiple ISPs. I know that it sounds like hack but it's even described in Cisco's Cookbook (ref http://fengnet.com/book/cisco.ios.cookbook.2nd/I_0596527225_CHP_9_SECT_6.html)

  • gbshousegbshouse Member, Host Rep

    @William - by the way I send you an email regarding this PI

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