Managed VPS with PHP 5x for dummies

ronn22

So, on this rainy evening with a hot cup of tea and soaking the senses in its aroma, I was looking at this page https://lowendbox.com/virtual-private-server-frequently-asked-questions-vps-faq/ and after some hasty and some slow reading of the same, I was wondering if there is any article here or anywhere w.r.t Managed VPS (Web panel based like C-Panel, && where Support staff can install stuffs on request). **Please also note ** that I am aware of possible risks or performance issues with PHP 5x - just for the sake of consideration, assume php 5x is okay, and then read on ....

1.
How to find what Virtualization the VPS host is using and what has the least chance of getting outdated ever ... that is to say: What Virtualization would be the BEST when you consider the clause 2. and 3. below

2.
I want my my VPS hardware (and its Virtualization technology) and the variant of Linux OS and Web-server inside it to support EA-PHP 5x to run for eternity. In this scenario, what OS do I choose? What Web-server? What Panel? [ Note : there are 3 questions here! ]
The OS, Webserver and the Panel I choose now, when upgraded & re-re-upgraded in future yet to come, should be always able to support my EA-PHP 5x always.
Are there such "eternal" options? If so what?

[ I have been looking at OS options : CentOS, Ubuntu, Debian etc, and I understand C-Panel was not supporting Ubuntu till the other day ... SEE Figure-1 below ...
I have been looling at Web-server options : standard Apache, Litespeed & OpenLiteSpeed, Nginx etc
I have been looking at the options : Cpanel, DirectAdmin, Interworx, various companies own VPS panels ... SEE Figure-2 below ...]

3.
I want my my VPS hardware (and its Virtualization technology) and the variant of Linux OS and Webserver inside it** to support "Hardened" PHP 5x [as provided by CloudLinux] to run for eternity**. In this scenario, what OS do I choose? What Web-server? What Panel?
The OS, Webserver and the Panel I choose now, when upgraded & re-re-upgraded in future yet to come, should be always able to support my "Hardened" PHP 5x always.
What are my options?

[ I have been looking at OS options : CentOS, Ubuntu, Debian etc, and I understand C-Panel was not supporting Ubuntu till the other day ... SEE Figure-1 below ...
I have been looling at Web-server options : standard Apache, Litespeed & OpenLiteSpeed, Nginx etc
I have been looking at the options : Cpanel, DirectAdmin, Interworx, various companies own VPS panels ... SEE Figure-2 below ...]

4.
It appears CentOS 8 is already EOL, and Centos 7 may be so, soon? What is CentOS Stream, will it be a drop-in replacement for 7 and 8? Else, what is the OS that I can choose from now on that will support my scenario of php 5x as detailed in clause 2. and 3. above
_Also I am curious to know When CloudLinux is installed is it a COMPLETE replacement for CentOS like Ubuntu or is CloudLinux OS just an add-on on top of CentOS ? PLEASE SEE Figure-3 below
Also, curious to know if any other entities are coming up with hardened-or-whatever php5x options to save million of small or smaller sites from fading into oblivion just as you do not demolish heritage buildings at random and shift to newer Sky-scrapers for better security or comfort or speed-of-life!

5.
Webserver - where there is choice of Web-server what is the BEST to choose from now on that will support my scenario of PHP 5x as detailed in clause 2. and 3. above always

6.
I will like to use Cpanel as the Panel for Managed VPS - but if Interworx or any other is better (or just equivalent), and can let me do multiple-LetsEncrypt-SSLs, File Manager, Web Mail set-ups, Phymyadmin & Back-ups via panel (as in CPanel) and more importantly if this Panel supports PHP 5x or "Hardened" PHP 5x (for eternity) such Panel would be more than welcome. So the question is where there is choice of Panels by my Hosting provider what do I choose, keeping in mind its life-long compatibility with OS and Web-server that will support it?
SEE Figure-2 below ...

7.
Apart from the really great resource lowendbox.com, in general what other Webhosting review sites are honestly dependable (independent and actual self-use-based reviews and not affiliates or not sponsored eg. by bluehost!) that discuss the above clauses 2. 3. 4. 5. & 6. in the following angles / tables / charts / otherwise ... PLEASE SEE Figure-4 below

yoursunny

Expect to pay a lot.
CloudLinux costs money.
cPanel costs money.
Running EOL'ed PHP version for an eternity costs even more money, because CloudLinux would eventually stop maintaining it, and whoever sells you managed service would basically have to hire someone to maintain the codebase.

Uptime down low. The end is nigh.

Falzo

with all the efforts you put into that, why not just continue one of your previous threads on this topic?

ronn22

@yoursunny Thanks for your valued input.
Keeping aside the money factor what I really want to know is it a possibility? For example, will supporting Hardware, CPU etc will still be available, even by dedicated server providers? Hardware that will continue to support past versions of CentOS/Ubuntu (of course, along with a Web-server and Database too) that will support php5x ?
By keeping aside money factor, I do not mean $1000 per month but at least $100 ($50 to $100 per month) in the next 5 or 10 years by which time I do not think CL will end its php5x support and someone may just come up with another hardened flawless version - (who knows?!!) and by which time (10 years) I think I can afford that money ...

The real constraint in Windows scenario is : I still have my Windows 5 or Netscape nicely preserved in CDs but if my old hardware is not working I probably cannot find new hardware, CPU etc that will run old Windows. I wonder what is such situation in the Linux/LAMP stack world. Thanks

Mr_Tom

Why do you absolutely require php 5?

eris

@Mr_Tom said:
Why do you absolutely require php 5?

Old code base / Legacy software that can't be updated or the client does not want to pay for a upgrade to PHP 8.0 / 7.x

And so on there might be 1001 reasons by it is not possible.. And if it is a non public facing web app it should probably not be an issue..

Mr_Tom

@eris said: And if it is a non public facing web app it should probably not be an issue..

That's a valid point.

ronn22

The Official CloudLinux site says "Several highly popular versions of PHP, used in nearly 85% of all PHP sites, are unsupported by the PHP.net community. HardenedPHP secures old and unsupported versions of PHP – 4.4.9, 5.1, 5.2 ...". Also the fact is that, of the twenty or thirty Web Hosts I know or keep track of, has not yet dropped support for php 5x except SiteGround. @Mr_Tom I need php5x to run a small website based on php 5x, using certain Drupal Modules for which updating to any latest version is not possible even if you pay high Developer fees. There is no client involved as it is my personal site, designed and maintained by me only and has a very small non-English user base (you can consider it as old Heritage building which I would like not to demolish to create a Modern Apartment) @eris Many thanks. Will be very glad if some one throws any specific light on the clause 2. and 3. above, apart from the other questions

angstrom

@Mr_Tom said:

@eris said: And if it is a non public facing web app it should probably not be an issue..

That's a valid point.

I thought that it was a public facing web app. (Otherwise why all the fuss concern?)

WebProject

We can host any solution, just message your exact specification and we will try to accommodate you, as we will be able to setup server using Plesk + CloudLinux with PHP5, if you wish?

Daniel15

PHP5

PHP 7.0 was released in 2015. If your software really still needs PHP 5.x then you need to ask the developer to start using a PHP version that was released in the last 7 years.

angstrom

@ronn22 said: I want my my VPS hardware (and its Virtualization technology) and the variant of Linux OS and Web-server inside it to support EA-PHP 5x to run for eternity. In this scenario, what OS do I choose? What Web-server? What Panel? [ Note : there are 3 questions here! ]

Of these three questions, the virtualization technology is the least of the worries.

But the other two questions and the "to run for eternity" are difficult.

eris

@Daniel15 said:

PHP5

PHP 7.0 was released in 2015. If your software really still needs PHP 5.x then you need to ask the developer to start using a PHP version that was released in the last 7 years.

Over 7 years.. 28 Aug 2004...

I totally agree with that there is some time the need for upgrading if possible. But sometimes the cost are higher to update it then it is worth for the client.. Or he doesn't care...

The question is then only how long Cloudlinux can develop the patches with backward compebiltiy at it a point where the development takes more time then the income...

dahartigan

This is possible, and it can be done. Like others have said, it will be expensive. Probably prohibitively expensive. You'd be looking at about $2000/month.

ronn22

Thanks to all very much for such a lively discussion.

@Daniel15 There is NO developer here - I am the dev, admin, designer all-in-all - its a small site - please remember that, its non-commercial and million such sites are there which will just evaporate or their users gobbled up by the dirty monopoly of FB and Google/Apple Apps (which basically killed the open and connected concept of Internet). CloudLinux stepped in for a reason, I guess, with php5x offerings.

@dahartigan Thanks. $2000/month from which year ?? At present what I asked for IS INDEED PROVIDED apparently by many managed or unmanaged VPS at less than $20 a month and their help-desks say this scenario may well continue for another 5 or 10 years at least.

• Does unmanaged VPS or Ded server allows you to run any version of CentOS and any version of PHP (for example someone suggested as a Docker image) or are there any security concerns on the host-side that prohibits this? For example you are not allowed to run Adult sites on some hosts even if u are hiring an empty baremetal - if they dont, I understand. If they do, do they charge $2000 to run otherwise "insecure" old versions? As I said, even shared hosts are still continuing php 5x as 80% or so sites still need that and those sites continue to provide business to webhosts and CL etc. (Drops making an ocean) The other aspect is - will newer hardwares to come still support older OS (Centos or others) that can run php5x ??? In case of Windows I find that newer hardware does not let you run older Windows OS. Is the thing different in Linux world?
• In present scenario of $20 a month (or LESS) what is the best choice then - what OS - ubuntu? CentOS? what else? and what Panel - C-Panel? Interworx? [ see figures above] - for example if I would like to run, say php5x, for another 3 to 5 years.?

I think I have to open separate threads for the other ignored questions

• When CloudLinux is installed is it a COMPLETE replacement for CentOS like Ubuntu or is CloudLinux OS just an add-on on top of CentOS ? [ See figure 3 above ]
• If CentOS 7 and 8 are ending life, what is the next best alternative - CentOS Stream? Ubuntu? Almalinux? that will be SAME in terms of support to Web-Servers, php5x, php7x
• C-Panel versus Plesk versus Interworx/others?? [ see figure 2 above ]
• Xen HVM versus KVM in above scenario ?
• what other Webhosting review sites are honestly dependable(independent and actual self-use-based reviews and not affiliates or not sponsored eg. by bluehost!) and that answers the Figure-4 above? I ask these as I find many web-hosting review sites contains a whole world of junk info but does not even review what OS, what Web-server, and what Panels are used by the services. Thanks.

Daniel15

@ronn22 said: There is NO developer here - I am the dev, admin, designer all-in-all - its a small site

If it's a small site then it should be easy to update it to be PHP 8 compatible

dahartigan

@ronn22 said:
@dahartigan Thanks. $2000/month from which year ?? At present what I asked for IS INDEED PROVIDED apparently by many managed or unmanaged VPS at less than $20 a month and their help-desks say this scenario may well continue for another 5 or 10 years at least.

$2000/month is the figure I come to when accounting for the non-technical aspects of managing your server. I anticipate, based off your thread(s) regarding this, that you're after a very specific set of circumstances, with technical demands that go strongly against the advice of knowledgeable, experienced and competent admins.

Also based off your threads, it's possible that you would generate a lot of tickets and extra work for the admin - the $20/month guy will fire you if you start that.

• Does unmanaged VPS or Ded server allows you to run any version of CentOS and any version of PHP (for example someone suggested as a Docker image) or are there any security concerns on the host-side that prohibits this? For example you are not allowed to run Adult sites on some hosts even if u are hiring an empty baremetal - if they dont, I understand. If they do, do they charge $2000 to run otherwise "insecure" old versions? As I said, even shared hosts are still continuing php 5x as 80% or so sites still need that and those sites continue to provide business to webhosts and CL etc. (Drops making an ocean) The other aspect is - will newer hardwares to come still support older OS (Centos or others) that can run php5x ??? In case of Windows I find that newer hardware does not let you run older Windows OS. Is the thing different in Linux world?

Again, the technical aspects aren't where the money is - it's the humans you need to help you do what you're trying to do.

I think I have to open separate threads for the other ignored questions

Please don't do that. You need to understand you're getting free advice here, and you need to be patient.

The best advice you can take from this is to simply keep your application with the times. Accept that things change and you need to change with it. If you can't, then you need to decide what that's worth to you or what you're missing out on.

ronn22

Thanks @dahartigan - Your advice is very valuable. Best regards.

eris

• Does unmanaged VPS or Ded server allows you to run any version of CentOS and any version of PHP (for example someone suggested as a Docker image) or are there any security concerns on the host-side that prohibits this? For example you are not allowed to run Adult sites on some hosts even if u are hiring an empty baremetal - if they dont, I understand. If they do, do they charge $2000 to run otherwise "insecure" old versions? As I said, even shared hosts are still continuing php 5x as 80% or so sites still need that and those sites continue to provide business to webhosts and CL etc. (Drops making an ocean) The other aspect is - will newer hardwares to come still support older OS (Centos or others) that can run php5x ??? In case of Windows I find that newer hardware does not let you run older Windows OS. Is the thing different in Linux world?
• In present scenario of $20 a month (or LESS) what is the best choice then - what OS - ubuntu? CentOS? what else? and what Panel - C-Panel? Interworx? [ see figures above] - for example if I would like to run, say php5x, for another 3 to 5 years.?

I think I have to open separate threads for the other ignored questions

• When CloudLinux is installed is it a COMPLETE replacement for CentOS like Ubuntu or is CloudLinux OS just an add-on on top of CentOS ? [ See figure 3 above ]
• If CentOS 7 and 8 are ending life, what is the next best alternative - CentOS Stream? Ubuntu? Almalinux? that will be SAME in terms of support to Web-Servers, php5x, php7x
• C-Panel versus Plesk versus Interworx/others?? [ see figure 2 above ]
• Xen HVM versus KVM in above scenario ?
• what other Webhosting review sites are honestly dependable(independent and actual self-use-based reviews and not affiliates or not sponsored eg. by bluehost!) and that answers the Figure-4 above? I ask these as I find many web-hosting review sites contains a whole world of junk info but does not even review what OS, what Web-server, and what Panels are used by the services. Thanks.

Cloudlinux is a separate OS. Compare what Ubuntu is from Debian. Cloudlinux is the "Fork" of Centos.

CentOS stream will be come the testing branch of Redhat and will become something the you can compare "Sid" from Debian with. So it might work fine but there are some bugs. So not smart to use for a webserver that needs to be stable...

I had run an Ubuntu 10 server for a years back and it kept working fine. As it was only accessible via VPN / internal network and the risk of updating was bigger then improvements it self we didn't bother updating it...

Yes an unmanaged VPS / Dedicated often allow you to install any OS you want and never care about it. If it is smart is up to you...