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LeaseWeb Deutschland takes my case to court in Amsterdam. Advise needed.
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LeaseWeb Deutschland takes my case to court in Amsterdam. Advise needed.

Hi,

The problem started in 2019 when they redesigned their admin interface. We started having problems with not being able to see current invoices, we received multiple invoices for the same servers, and invoices which did not specify which equipment they was for.

Since after several calls and emails we still could not get an answer on which invoices were correct and which were incorrect, our servers were deactivated.

We then chose to end our collaboration with LeaseWeb. The last contact we had with LeaseWeb was 2019-08-19 when we sent the following email:

Dear Leaseweb,

As a customer we are very unhappy with your lack of responses to our questions, emails, and customer service. We have had nothing but problems since you upgraded / migrated / modified the customer portal as of April 8th.

We will not pay any of the invoices below, (amount of ~€530) and we do not want to do any more business with you. It has taken too much of our time and effort to sort out your problems.

We recently paid €613.69 for a 12 month contract for the our DE server. You are free to cancel/disconnect this server and use the €613.69 to pay any due invoices, even those that does not specify which equipment they refer to, and even those who have arisen because you do not answer the questions we have.

We no longer have any confidence in you as a company, and we will not spend any more time solving problems for continued collaboration with your company.

Regards
xxx xxxx

xxxxxxxx

The time goes any we are very happy with the other hosting provided that se moved to.

But, In December 2020, I received a letter from Leaseweb's debt collection company TKB INCASSO regarding an invoice that was created at the end of 2020 for the amount of € 676.19 and applies to a new advance-payment for a new period for the server we had in DE which was cancelled.

We dispute the invoice to both TKB and Leaseweb, but neither of these has responded.

Yesterday I received a second letter (via regular post) from TKB INCASSO. They will bring the amount to court in Amsterdam if I don't wire the amount before 2021-01-27.

Following url is a PDF of this letter: http://docdro.id/r1KYA4N

I'm in desperate need for help. From what I understand, the court in Amsterdam will rule in LeaseWeb's favor if I cannot be present in person to dispute the invoice.

What should/can I do?

«13

Comments

  • Consult with a lawyer?
    @deank

    Status | Site 1 2 3

  • LTnigerLTniger Member
    edited January 23

    This forum is not the place to seek legal advice/help. Contact your country lawyer and sort this matter. It seems LW just sold your debt to TKB and that's it. Now you are getting pawned hard. Where do you live? If it's somewhere deep in Russia (maybe with Agafia?) than it's safe to ignore.

    Either way, talking to LW is useless as they sold your dept to dept collectors. GG mate.

    Thanked by 1jar

    #!/Bashblog.net | Free Wordpress Hosting | If you can't idle, what's the point?

  • WSCallumWSCallum Member, Provider

    Seek proper legal advise and representation rather than posting on LET, you aren't going to get much help here in terms of what you're looking for.

    Clouveo - SSD/NVMe Cloud VPS & Hosting
    AMD EPYC & Intel E Cloud VPS | DDoS Protected | Snapshots | Auto Backups

  • For me it would be helpful to know if anyone else have experience with LeaseWebs mafia methods.

    I live in Sweden, so a lawyer is around $200/hour.

  • @rotkiv said: What should/can I do?

    You appear to think that a random person on a random hosting forum can help you

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • thedpthedp Member

    You can't just mail them and expect things to go your way by threatening them by not wanting to pay your invoices.

    Next time, if you want to cancel services, use the proper method/process of cancelling
    services.

    DP | Domain Names for Sale: r*.ninja / vm*.net / virt*.com / node*.org / *gigabit.net / *vpn.net


  • Mahfuz_SS_EHLMahfuz_SS_EHL Member, Provider

    Is that Court in Amsterdam that hard ?? Or, in the whole EU ?

    AlphaSSL Revocation Issue is being investigated.

  • thedp: On the other hand, our account was deactivated after that e-email.

  • Find a lawyer to write a response, or write your own response and mail it.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll
    edited January 23

    The fact that the dude is not seeking a lawyer means -

    the end is nigh on his arse or say good bye to few hundreds of Euros.

    Common sense, people. But then it's not the end of the world.

    Thanked by 1coolice

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • thedpthedp Member

    Even IF anyone here wanted to help or could help in any way possible, you'd still need a lawyer on your end, since it's a court/legal case.

    DP | Domain Names for Sale: r*.ninja / vm*.net / virt*.com / node*.org / *gigabit.net / *vpn.net


  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    Nah, nobody can help him online. He needs a physical presence in the court just to fight.

    Just do nothing and lose out about 1k euro. That's the cheapest option, I think.

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • ehabehab Member

    collect all your invoices and documents and call up one lawyer first thing on Monday.

    • do not prepay > 1 year and check for reviews/support
    • only use monthly from a provider operating < 1 year 🍆
  • acidpukeacidpuke Member
    edited January 23

    Only contact a lawyer if they proceed with an action, at this point its just a threat. Save your money.

    3rd party lawsuits can be tricky, Usually they would have to subpoena a LeaseWeb employee to substantiate any records under oath at trial other wise its hearsay.

    3rd party just postures and hopes you cave in and settle before trial or the case get thrown out at trial for lack of evidence, For the small amount of this claim the 3rd party collections probably isn't going to roll the dice and pay for a LeaseWeb employee to show up.

    If I was OP I would write back and state I dispute all charges, and reject your offer.

  • marvelmarvel Member, Provider
    edited January 23

    I'm from NL so I think I can clarify this.

    Your letter is from an 'INCASSO' company. 99% of the time these companies are bluffing, threatening you with court if you don't pay up. It's just to persuade you to pay, nothing more.

    Any company here can go to any Incasso company and do this, it's very easy. This is no legal action yet.

    If I see the amount, taking you to court for that amount, a foreign person, and then try to get their €700 that way will never be worth it for them. Even if they take it to court and the judge says you have to pay it's very hard for them to collect if you're not in NL.

    Seriously I would just ignore this.

    Btw even if they take it to court you can respond by post. You don't need to show. Or you can have a lawyer go for you, but until they take you to court I wouldn't do anything. If they do explain the story to the judge with decent amount of proof.

  • agomezagomez Member, Provider

    Hello,

    First of all, have you already been clarified to which server the invoice corresponds?, In that email, from the server located in "DE", that you had paid, and then say that they used that amount to satisfy pending invoices, did they cancel that server after your email?

    Thanked by 2cpsd rotkiv
  • YmpkerYmpker Member
    edited January 23

    @rotkiv said:
    For me it would be helpful to know if anyone else have experience with LeaseWebs mafia methods.

    I live in Sweden, so a lawyer is around $200/hour.

    https://www.justanswer.com/law/ connects you with lawyers at way less than that for a first consultation. Give it a shot :)

    Thanked by 2rotkiv Edmond
  • YmpkerYmpker Member
    edited January 23

    @acidpuke said:
    Only contact a lawyer if they proceed with an action, at this point its just a threat. Save your money.

    3rd party lawsuits can be tricky, Usually they would have to subpoena a LeaseWeb employee to substantiate any records under oath at trial other wise its hearsay.

    3rd party just postures and hopes you cave in and settle before trial or the case get thrown out at trial for lack of evidence, For the small amount of this claim the 3rd party collections probably isn't going to roll the dice and pay for a LeaseWeb employee to show up.

    If I was OP I would write back and state I dispute all charges, and reject your offer.

    Did my man here watch Suits?

    Anyway, being in the right does not always equate to becoming justice. That's what lawyers are for.

    Thanked by 1acidpuke
  • deankdeank Member, Troll
    edited January 23

    Is OP even in the right?

    I didn't read the whole shit wall of shit, but didn't he run away with 500 euro by breaking his contract?

    The collections agency bought the debt which has now increased to 650 euro.

    The longer you drag this, the higher sum will be. Given enough years, it will exceed few thousand euro, and OP will be dragged into a court battle at one point.

    It's better to take care of this early before it actually damages you.

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • In the second page it says they want you to appear in court in two thousand twenty. So you need to be there in the past? That seems like a form mistake to me.

    However, I am not a laywer. But as an entrepreneur I can say having customers not paying their bills is not cool.

  • If you are legally right (find out by contacting a lawyer) , fight the case legally and give them a fight. You may even get compensated, yes sue these corporate mafias for your losses if you have proof and for the harassment caused. Who they are to think they can do whatever even after being so wrong.

    Contact a lawyer either way.

  • rotkivrotkiv Member
    edited January 23

    @agomez said:
    Hello,

    First of all, have you already been clarified to which server the invoice corresponds?, In that email, from the server located in "DE", that you had paid, and then say that they used that amount to satisfy pending invoices, did they cancel that server after your email?

    Well, I've asked TKB INCASSO to specify what the amount refer to without success, however, they fail to answer. Leaseweb also refuse to answer, and I now see in thier terms that they will not discuss a matter once it's handed over to a debt collector.

    This is kinda what upsets me even more, since their approach feels like mafia methods with threats, instead of conducting a dialogue.

    My best guess is that the amount is for a new 12-month term for the DE server + the deactivation/reactivation charge of €62.5.

    The terms also state that once the pre-paid amount for the 12-months service is payed via a debt collector, the service will not be restored.

    What I did wrong was that I did not verify that the DE server actually had been cancelled. I was upset when I wrote the e-mail and I spent the next two weeks to migrate everything to another host.

    Reason I was upset when I wrote the e-mail in 2019 to cancel our cooperation and cancel the servers was because our other servers were being suspended for due invoices when we were still having discussions with several persons at Leaseweb which invoices were correct and which were invalid due to thier migration (instead of one account for all servers, they migrated so we got one account for each country we had servers in, but all accounts generated invoices for all servers, with invalid server ids). I literally spent 1 hour on phone with a sales guy trying to help me, promising me to come back via phone as soon as possible with a list of the correct invoices but that it might take a while since it was a mess, only to find out three days later when I called again I got the message that he was no longer an employee of Leaseweb.

    I see now today that the Leaseweb terms state that a server should be cancelled via a ticket in the admin, which I did not since I sent an e-mail.

    Specifically, I made a mistake when I did not verify that the server was terminated. And that may be the mistake that makes me actually pay for another 11 months for a service that Leaseweb will not restore.

    On the other hand, the work with the migration from leaseweb cost twenty times as much, so it is a small sum in this context.

    But it feels wrong.

  • thedpthedp Member

    Nevertheless, thank you for contacting LowEndLawyers!

    DP | Domain Names for Sale: r*.ninja / vm*.net / virt*.com / node*.org / *gigabit.net / *vpn.net


  • verovero Member, Provider
    edited January 23

    TL;DR If you are not from NL, they can't do anything to you. If you are from NL you will need lawyer only if this case actually reaches court.

    Update. If they would be smart and persistent enough to sue you in your country, the same - only then you will need lawyer. Yet this option is unthinkable. There's a bigger chance to become president of the US.

  • jsgjsg Member
    edited January 23

    @rotkiv

    I'm not a lawyer but have quite some experience with things like that.

    • First and probably most important: that letter came from an incasso company and it's totally normal to start by threatening because it's the cheapest way for them and surprisingly often works.
    • "Holy rule": DO NOT SIMPLY IGNORE THEM! Answer them. Short and dry along the lines that you object to their demand and that invoice and that you never got an invoice after [time of last invoice plus 1 day].
    • Second "holy rule": Do not be afraid, do not panic. There is no reason to. You are just at the first stage of an ugly game and threatening you with words is one thing but actually going to court is another and very different thing and a step those gangster often do not take.
    • IF it ever went to court leaseweb would be asked to prove that there are grounds for their new invoice. You on the other hand would be asked to provide evidence for your assertion that they do not have any basis (because you cancelled your contract and never again heard from them for over a year).
    • Worst case:You don't know NL law and they somehow get a court order in their favour - even then you needed not panic because they would need to enforce it in your country to which you could object and go to court in your country.

    One of the most important steps to be taken by you has already been taken. You have provided us with information and evidence that strongly suggests that @LeaseWeb seems to be a shady company and basically running extortion rackets.

    In case you are not in Europe: don't worry, we have quite acceptable consumer protection laws.

    Additional info: quite often it's not their "customer" (e.g. leaseweb) who asks them to act but rather the incasso company buys your (alleged) debts for a fraction of the nominal value and then tries to you to pay the full nominal value. In other words: it's simply a (dirty) business which must make sense economically for them (which is one of the reasons they often threaten but actually do not go to court).

    Thanked by 1rotkiv

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • jsgjsg Member

    @rotkiv said:
    Well, I've asked TKB INCASSO to specify what the amount refer to without success, however, they fail to answer. Leaseweb also refuse to answer, and I now see in thier terms that they will not discuss a matter once it's handed over to a debt collector.

    One of them must answer and within a reasonable period of time. If they don't they risk to provide you (or your lawyer) solid bullets against them.

    But, IMPORTANT: be sure to only communicate via registered (snail) mail! (Courts love formaility and clear cut evidence).

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @jsg said:

    • "Holy rule": DO NOT SIMPLY IGNORE THEM! Answer them.

    Agreed. And tell them to f**k off. That's what I did numerous times. They are usually highly incompetent and even more often are unable to take actions. Even if they take actions, they won't get anything more than your provider would have got initially. There's no bonus for them, unless their client (Leaseweb) pays part of this debt if they win in court. But that's too long and too risky story for such rats.

  • jsgjsg Member

    @vero said:

    @jsg said:

    • "Holy rule": DO NOT SIMPLY IGNORE THEM! Answer them.

    Agreed. And tell them to f**k off. That's what I did numerous times. They are usually highly incompetent and even more often are unable to take actions. Even if they take actions, they won't get anything more than your provider would have got initially. There's no bonus for them, unless their client (Leaseweb) pays part of this debt if they win in court. But that's too long and too risky story for such rats.

    It's largely a question of numbers. For €50 they'll hardly go beyond a threatening letter. For €5000 or even more it makes economical sense to go to court, follow through internationally, etc. For, as in this case a couple of hundred€ but far less than a 4 digit number I guess it boils down to where @rotkiv lives. If it's a non-european jurisdiction or even a problematic one (for them) they'll probably drop it rather sooner than later. But if it's a european one, possibly even a nearby one they'll highly likely try to get a court order and go on.

    Important side note: Such cases are often decided against the victim simply because victim didn't react. So, again: Communicate only by registered snail mail! That drastically increases their risk to be bitchslapped if they get a NL court order because they didn't mention your correspondence.

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @jsg said:
    It's largely a question of numbers. For €50 they'll hardly go beyond a threatening letter. For €5000 or even more it makes economical sense to go to court, follow through internationally, etc. For, as in this case a couple of hundred€ but far less than a 4 digit number I guess it boils down to where @rotkiv lives. If it's a non-european jurisdiction or even a problematic one (for them) they'll probably drop it rather sooner than later. But if it's a european one, possibly even a nearby one they'll highly likely try to get a court order and go on.

    If it's European jurisdiction then what? Suing internationally for €5000? How many trips they can afford for such amount? I don't know really, but it doesn't sound real. Even if they have some sort of partners in that other country, they have to calculate the percentage of success quite thoroughly. In this case everything looks like a complete mess. But yes, you are right - what money can't do, big money can. If OP would have blown up Leaseweb's data center, most likely they would pay a visit.

    Important side note: Such cases are often decided against the victim simply because victim didn't react. So, again: Communicate only by registered snail mail! That drastically increases their risk to be bitchslapped if they get a NL court order because they didn't mention your correspondence.

    If you say "I won't pay" or you say "**** ***" that's basically the same. If you don't answer, that changes nothing. The most important part was when OP tried to solve everything directly with provider. If they passed this to some agency, that's a war.

  • jsgjsg Member
    edited January 23

    @vero said:
    If it's European jurisdiction then what? Suing internationally for €5000? How many trips they can afford for such amount? I don't know really, but it doesn't sound real. Even if they have some sort of partners in that other country, they have to calculate the percentage of success quite thoroughly.

    I'm not so sure about that. They'll highly likely guarantee a minimal fixed fee (like 50 €) and otherwise share both potential profit and risk.
    Also, in many cases courts accept each others orders intra-EU.

    Important side note: Such cases are often decided against the victim simply because victim didn't react. So, again: Communicate only by registered snail mail! That drastically increases their risk to be bitchslapped if they get a NL court order because they didn't mention your correspondence.

    If you say "I won't pay" or you say "**** ***" that's basically the same. If you don't answer, that changes nothing. The most important part was when OP tried to solve everything directly with provider. If they passed this to some agency, that's a war.

    No, because leaseweb controls much of the correspondence (e.g. via tickets) so client can't easily prove what he says. Also keep in mind that many judges don't give a lot about electronic communication like emails which can be easily faked, changed, etc.
    Plus someone accused who seems to - or can be painted in such a way - not care and not react looks bad.
    Also, a "f_ck you!" is much less promising psychologically than creating the impression of being a knowledgeable and cool opponent.

    Finally and importantly it's virtually meaningless what leaseweb thiks (by now). What's important is how judges would perceive the situation and evolution and how credible they deem both sides. A party that reacts properly (for courts that means within reasonable time and formally correct) always looks much better than one relying on electronic communication, lack of emotional self-control and careless, too late.

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @jsg said:

    I'm not so sure about that. They'll highly likely guarantee a minimal fixed fee (like 50 €) and otherwise share both potential profit and risk.
    Also, in many cases courts accept each others orders intra-EU.

    Thanks for sharing, didn't know that. Interesting how it works because of different legislation in different countries.

    No, because leaseweb controls much of the correspondence (e.g. via tickets) so client can't easily prove what he says. Also keep in mind that many judges don't give a lot about electronic communication like emails which can be easily faked, changed, etc.
    Plus someone accused who seems to - or can be painted in such a way - not care and not react looks bad.
    Also, a "f_ck you!" is much less promising psychologically than creating the impression of being a knowledgeable and cool opponent.

    There are so many polite ways to say something without saying it. But with such agencies you can be completely open and straightforward. We should not waste our time trying to impress trash.

    Finally and importantly it's virtually meaningless what leaseweb thiks (by now). What's important is how judges would perceive the situation and evolution and how credible they deem both sides. A party that reacts properly (for courts that means within reasonable time and formally correct) always looks much better than one relying on electronic communication, lack of emotional self-control and careless, too late.

    What you write here is completely obvious, I suppose. My point is - it's to late for negotiations. OP can send letters, but all his electronic communication should serve as evidence pretty fine, considering the age we are living in. Last of all - I would bet this case won't reach court if OP is in different country and 10% of probability if he's in the same country. BTW - I tried to sue one similar agency because they tried to get money from me, but this didn't go far; they are allowed to do that at some extent: they can call you and text you whenever they want, they can piss you off and get away with that. Still, I think I paid them back (most of the workers they had) :D

    Thanked by 1Edmond
  • jsgjsg Member
    edited January 23

    @vero said:
    What you write here is completely obvious, I suppose. My point is - it's to late for negotiations. OP can send letters, but all his electronic communication should serve as evidence pretty fine, considering the age we are living in.

    No negotiations needed. Just acting like a good guy (as seen from a judge) plus not providing any bullets to leaseweb and their enforcement gang and making the enforcers work harder (maybe stop them in their tracks)

    And now, if you'll excuse me, I'd like to end our discussion because my intention was absolutely not to be Mr. Smart or to win an argument but simply to help @rotkiv, especially to sooth his fear and to help him to avoid unnecessary panic.
    Again, I'm not a lawyer but I guess with some (re)acting smartly and keeping his cool, a lawyer will not even be needed. I sincerely hope that I could help rotkiv a bit.

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @jsg said:
    And now, if you'll excuse me, I'd like to end our discussion because my intention was absolutely not to be Mr. Smart or to win an argument but simply to help @rotkiv, especially to sooth his fear and to help him to avoid unnecessary panic.

    This discussion was quite fruitful. Poll for Mr. Smart is in another thread BTW :) And there's no reason to excuse, we just shared our knowledge, that's why we are here. OP already did what he needed to do. Panic is completely unavoidable on one's first encounter with court and fear is not going anywhere after second or third time, but it becomes controllable.

    Again, I'm not a lawyer but I guess with some (re)acting smartly and keeping his cool, a lawyer will not even be needed. I sincerely hope that I could help rotkiv a bit.

    I think he won't need anything at all, but if that's not the case, forum advice might not work well. If one is not completely stupid, he wont start swearing to every person he meets also he will keep some evidence for future use. That's self-understood for me, but perhaps it was worth pointing out. When it comes to debt collectors, there's quite a different language they understand (not necessarily f words), but being benevolent is treated as being weak by them. An average law abiding citizen doesn't meet such scum often in his life, so usually he doesn't know how to react. And they take advantage of that. So my advice - you can be polite with them is such way, that they would not want to or feel extremely uncomfortable to contact you once again.

  • jsgjsg Member

    @vero

    Thanks, yes I enjoyed our discussion, too. It's just that I think that I have provided enough points to @rotkiv (who seems to not even follow this thread anymore. Sad.), and I have other things to do. Plus, here in Europe it's already quite late.

    Have a nice weekend - and to rotkiv: Stay cool and good luck!

    Thanked by 1vero

    The problem with democracy is that by definition > 85% of the voters are not particularly intelligent.

  • My 2 cents., You live in another country, A lawyer will be very expensive for the amount they are taking you to court. I thing the smart thing to do is, try to negotiate the debt with the collector. offer 50% of the total, tell them you live in another country and they will never get a cent from you., but even if you pay 70% is not bad, according your own writing here you breached the contract.

    Thanked by 1rotkiv
  • pikepike Member

    @marvel said:
    Even if they take it to court and the judge says you have to pay it's very hard for them to collect if you're not in NL.

    You got these fancy license plate scanners at the border, and for quite some germans the dutch coast is the closest beach they can get to.

  • you answer can be find in Netflix - Suits

  • rotkivrotkiv Member
    edited January 24

    Thanks a lot for all the advice I have received so far.

    I have now slept on the matter and apologized to my wife for being in such a bad mood all day yesterday.

    I try to stay calm but it makes me really fucking pissed that leaseweb does not even want to take the slightest responsibility for their technical problems in the summer of 2019 that forced us to change provider in the middle of the summer holidays, and instead continue to chase advance invoices for new periods via debt collection companies.

    TBK INCASSO has now after 2 months has not responded to any of our emails where we ask them to specify which invoices at leaseweb to which the collection amount applies. They do not respond to e-mails at all, but instead become more threatening in every letter they send via snail mail.

    Before I went to bed yesterday, I paid € 613.69 directly to LeaseWeb. I will not pay anything to this suspicious debt collection company. This covers the cost of a new 12-month period. I have to take responsibility for this cost because I terminated the server via email instead of via a ticket in the summer of 2019.

    Quite frankly, I would like to call a higher person at leaseweb where we can agree on something, but I simply can not bear to have more contact with them. It was too exhausting last time when all the problems started. In this context, € 600 is a small sum to never have to have contact with them again or be reminded of them again.

    The remaining cost of ~ € 200 which includes collection costs and LeaseWeb's "deactivation charge" I will not pay.

    Am I stupid to pay? Probably. This is not the fight to pick. Time and well-being is worth more than money. This also reminds me how incredibly happy we are with the hosting provider we changed to. I gotta send them a thanks for great service on monday.

  • ShazanShazan Provider

    I would suggest you next time to pay first, then dispute later...
    If you don't find a solution after you dispute, then migrate to another provider without leaving any debts behind.
    Leaving this kind of issues open never ends well.

    Noamweb - Managed hosting in Italy

  • smallbibismallbibi Member
    edited January 24

    @rotkiv said: Am I stupid to pay? Probably. This is not the fight to pick. Time and well-being is worth more than money. This also reminds me how incredibly happy we are with the hosting provider we changed to. I gotta send them a thanks for great service on monday.

    Next thing you know, they end up mailing you for the remaining 200+ euros with some interest tacked on top... I think you have to send leaseweb and the collection agency registered mail to check if they consider your debt settled. Also, I don't know how this stuff works but it's quite likely that leaseweb sold your debt for cheap to the collection agency, and you kinda paid the wrong company.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    Yep, Leaseweb sold the debt. Happens all the time.

    OP can certainly ignore it. I mean the amount is small enough for them not to bother. But, given enough years, with interest (Usually 20%), the amount will be large enough.
    It will take several years though.

    When big enough, that's when they will hit you. Seen it happen more than a few around me. A dude ignores an invoice, and it eventually bites his arse a decade later.

    Of course, the agency can chalk it off when they deem it's not worth it. I'd say it's 50/50 that it will eventually bite your arse.

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • JioJio Member

    so to be clear you signed a contract and then decided to cancel it by saying 'im not paying'?

  • pakhostpakhost Member
    edited January 24

    @rotkiv It is totally a new experience I listened from you. If you don't wanna use LW services anymore, then just their renewal invoices. But, how they can force you for pay renewal invoices.

    Edit: In hosting business, services will be activated after payment. When LW will not receive any payment regarding the concerned service, they will not activate the service and matter will be finished. But why they are forcing you to make payment for renewal. It is totally unclear for me.

    PakCloudHost - Shared Hosting (Starts from $8.38/year), VPS Hosting and Dedicated Servers

  • @Jio said:
    so to be clear you signed a contract and then decided to cancel it by saying 'im not paying'?

    In July 2019 we paid for a 12 months contract for this server. One month later in August 2019 we cancelled the server via e-mail due to technical problems which they failed to solve. We cancelled all our servers with LeaseWeb and switched provider.

    We never took the server into use during the first 12 months which we payed for, and accepted the loss of money since we did not want to spend any more time with thier customer service.

    In July 2020 they send an advance-payment invoice for a new 12-months. We dispute this. They never answer to our disputes and in Dec 2021 we started to be harrased from thier debt collection company. We dispute the invoice and attach our dialogue with LeaseWeb, our cancellation and all the technical issues. We never receive any reply from
    the dept collection company, nor leaseweb.

    And now they threaten to take this to court on Jan 27.

  • deankdeank Member, Troll
    edited January 24

    So, you just broke your contract on whim.

    A contract must be cancelled mutually.

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • @rotkiv said: And now they threaten to take this to court on Jan 27.

    Actually, they were going to begin with the procedures on 27 Jan, so you had plenty of time to make a response after they give you a court date. I'd like to recommend you to send them registered mail again just to check on their view of your debt. I think they are not going to chase you for this small amount but you value your well-being, no?

  • deankdeank Member, Troll

    He does not. If he did, he would have consulted with a lawyer of some sort.

    He wouldn't have started this thread to begin with.

    "Jarland is stupid."

  • rotkivrotkiv Member
    edited January 24

    @deank said:
    He does not. If he did, he would have consulted with a lawyer of some sort.

    He wouldn't have started this thread to begin with.

    Only a lawyer would recommend a company to hire a lawyer for an b2b dispute of € 800.

    Given your answers, it just seems like you want to provoke.

    Thanked by 1TimboJones
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