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New hosting comapny comming, opinions and wishes wanted!
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New hosting comapny comming, opinions and wishes wanted!

VpsFlowVpsFlow Member, No Sales

So, after alot of years of experience with hosting, it is time to take a huge step and register a company instead of renting out vms over email. We are specific plans on what to offer, and how to do it. We have a decent budget to start up, have no big expences, and will take it slow and steady as a start. This way, we are sure to not simply dissapear after a few months like we see alot here.

The plan is to host KVM Ryzen vps servers out of Hetzner, both with hdd and nvme. We will be running virtualizor, and whmcs (or blesta, we are still testing to see what we like the most).

My question to you, is what plans would you like to see?
Here is a few examples of what we want to offer :

All plans comes with 10gbit port speed, 1 dedicated ipv4, unlimited traffic. Cpu cores and network is fair share. We will not be idiots and block people using their resources, but if you pin your cpu at 100% over days at a time, we might email you and look for solutions. There will be some rules in virtualizor also making sure resources are shared fair over all clients on the nodes.

1vcore, 1gb ram, 20gb nvme
Price around $4

1vcore, 2gb ram, 40gb nvme
Price around $6

2 vcore, 4gb ram, 60gb nvme
Price around $10

4 vcore, 8gb ram, 120gb nvme
Price around $18

8 vcore, 16gb ram, 240gb nvme
Price around $30

16 vcore, 32gb ram, 480gb nvme
Price around $55

For storage servers, we are going to run LOCAL disks WITH raid, so performance will be alot better than most network based storage virtual servers. We are not sure if we want to price our storage vps servers per TB, or make specific packages, but we should be able to offer 1 vcore, 1gb ram, 1TB for around $6 per month. Simply add it up to get the storage you need. For example :

10vcore, 10gb ram, 10.000gb hdd will be around $60

This is in no way a sales post. This is more a post to check the market, and see if our pricing is on point. While doing those prices, we will profit alright, without overselling anything. We have done alot of math and planning into this.

Thank you for your attention. We are looking forward to launch our products soon!

What is your thoughts on pricing?
  1. Its good25 votes
    1. To high
      68.00%
    2. To low
      24.00%
    3. I want other packages (please comment what you want!)
        8.00%

Comments

  • thedpthedp Member

    I would like to see you apply for a Provider tag first.

    Tech/Hosting & Miscellaneous Domain Names For Sale!

  • VpsFlowVpsFlow Member, No Sales

    @thedp said:
    I would like to see you apply for a Provider tag first.

    We just registered, this is not a sales post, this is a post to see what you think about the pricing we plan to roll out. Please read the post again.

    VpsFlow

  • FlowVPS vs VpsFlow

    Status | Site 1 2 3

  • I suggest you to think of a new name first since we already have FlowVPS and don’t need it to be confused with VPSFlow or w/e in future should you deadpool

    Thanked by 1mrclown
  • I smell summerhost..

    A simple uptime dashboard using UptimeRobot API https://upy.duo.ovh
    Currently using VPS from BuyVM, Gullo's, Hetzner, HostHatch, HostSailor, HostSolutions, InceptionHosting, LetBox, MaxKVM, MrVM, VirMach.

  • marvelmarvel Member, Provider

    Don't do it. There is no profit to be made.

    You have your licensing costs for WHMCS and Virtualizor. Your IPv4 costs (which I think with Hetzner you pay $1 per IP per month) and then your dedicated server costs which will literally skyrocket. Not even talking about the amount of hours you have to put into it. And then you still need some room for profit, it's impossible.

    Let's say you sell a VPS for $4 / month which with those specs is already quite expensive if you look at some of the deals here where they sell for $20/year. Then there's the payment gateway fees (which I totally forgot about). Maybe, maybe if you're very lucky at the end of the month $0.25 - $0.50 of that $4 goes into your pocket but you probably have to put extra money on the table.

    And for that you have a customer opening tickets, abusing your service, doing all kinds of other stuff to keep you busy. (Did I already mention you need a payed Maxmind subscription?) Trust me it's not worth it.

    It's better to buy rack space, buy your own servers and lease or buy your IPs and do specialized hosting. I mean like game servers, seedboxes or something else. The lowend VPS market is completely saturated. You will never be able to compete with companies like Contabo or OVH and there is no reason for anybody to choose you over them unless they want to host kiddie porn or launch ddos attacks.

  • 10g unmetered? Did you account for the $1/tb overage and users that definately will abuse your unmetered offer?

  • MoofieMoofie Member

    :s :s :s :s

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider
    edited January 5

    Hey bud,

    Everything set aside, you are not really leaving much room for profit or future expansion with that pricing.

    Your highest plan brings your cost/gb ram to $1.71/month.

    Assuming your node will have 128 GB ram, that is +-125 of “sellable” ram, without over committing.

    Brings your monthly income for that server to ~214/month.

    Set aside 7% for payment processor fees.

    Deduct $10 for virtualizor

    Now that’s $190/month. If you are lucky and manage to keep 100% of your nodes full, your profit % is way too slim to pay a basic salary for one person, unless you have a massive fleet of servers, all 100%.

    Rework the numbers. Don’t focus on being the cheapest and don’t compete with price. Leave buffer room for bad months, Cancelation, disaster etc.

    All the best :)

  • sntsnt Member

    I wish u good luck!

  • Ian_Dot_TechIan_Dot_Tech Member, Provider

    @marvel said:
    Don't do it. There is no profit to be made.

    You have your licensing costs for WHMCS and Virtualizor. Your IPv4 costs (which I think with Hetzner you pay $1 per IP per month) and then your dedicated server costs which will literally skyrocket. Not even talking about the amount of hours you have to put into it. And then you still need some room for profit, it's impossible.

    Let's say you sell a VPS for $4 / month which with those specs is already quite expensive if you look at some of the deals here where they sell for $20/year. Then there's the payment gateway fees (which I totally forgot about). Maybe, maybe if you're very lucky at the end of the month $0.25 - $0.50 of that $4 goes into your pocket but you probably have to put extra money on the table.

    And for that you have a customer opening tickets, abusing your service, doing all kinds of other stuff to keep you busy. (Did I already mention you need a payed Maxmind subscription?) Trust me it's not worth it.

    It's better to buy rack space, buy your own servers and lease or buy your IPs and do specialized hosting. I mean like game servers, seedboxes or something else. The lowend VPS market is completely saturated. You will never be able to compete with companies like Contabo or OVH and there is no reason for anybody to choose you over them unless they want to host kiddie porn or launch ddos attacks.

    Completely agree except we don't need more summer hosts in the gaming industry, there are already a ton failing and saturating the market each year.

    @VpsFlow Like others have already said, it's too low margins and a heavily over-saturated market. You would more than likely make more money from a lemonade stand these days.

    If you do proceed, I wish you the best of luck.

    ★ DDoS Protected COLOCATION, DEDICATED SERVERS & KVM VPS ★ Skype: ian.d95 ★ Discord: Ian.D#8515
    ★ www.leveloneservers.com ★ Dallas, TX ★ Dot-Tech LLC AS398395

  • verovero Member, Provider
    edited January 5

    @VpsFlow said:
    We have done alot of math and planning into this.

    "No strategy survives first contact with the enemy" was said by one military leader in 19th century and he was so damn right..

    Update. As for wishes part - I wish you a Happy New Year.

  • Why should I go with you instead of going directly with Hetzner (cloud) for a fraction of the cost?

  • No IPv6?

  • VpsFlowVpsFlow Member, No Sales

    Thanks for the feedbacks.
    I dont really need to make alot of money doing this. As long as each node covers the running costs, plus a little something extra, im fine.

    I see you are taking Hetzner cloud in here as a comparison. Two main reasons to pick me instead would be 10gbit, and Ryzen cores, who out performs hetzner cloud easily. Also, personal support with thing you may need help with, who hetzner just replys "hardware and network is fine, read our wiki" and then ignores you.

    I understand this is not easy, simple or something to get rich for. Thank you for feedback so far

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @VpsFlow said: I dont really need to make alot of money doing this. As long as each node covers the running costs, plus a little something extra, im fine.

    Well that's is a fair logic. But then it becomes a hobby and not business.

    @VpsFlow said: Also, personal support with thing you may need help with, who hetzner just replys "hardware and network is fine, read our wiki" and then ignores you.

    This is where it gets tricky. It is easy when you are small. Once you grow, you will have more users and more tickets. Now you will either need to hire quality staff or you will need to dedicated more time to offer that kind of support.

    With slim profit margin, that becomes the toughest part, as time costs money, quality labor costs money.

    Are you willing to stay up 24/7, sacrifice personal life and sanity to make $50 end of the month?

    Thanked by 1vero
  • VpsFlowVpsFlow Member, No Sales

    @seriesn said: @VpsFlow said: Also, personal support with thing you may need help with, who hetzner just replys "hardware and network is fine, read our wiki" and then ignores you.

    This is where it gets tricky. It is easy when you are small. Once you grow, you will have more users and more tickets. Now you will either need to hire quality staff or you will need to dedicated more time to offer that kind of support.

    With slim profit margin, that becomes the toughest part, as time costs money, quality labor costs money.

    Are you willing to stay up 24/7, sacrifice personal life and sanity to make $50 end of the month?

    I understand your thoughts. To offer 24/7 support on all topics will not be possible, i agree with that. But when it comes to issues with network, nodes etc, we should be able to monitor and respond fairly fast if something happends.

    When it comes to "extra support" who other providers (often) wont give you, we will provide it where we can and help out (just as yourself would do, right?), but it will be in the TOS that we dont have to give it, i believe.

    Time and labour is ofcourse factors here. The fact is that my back got broken a few years back, and because of this im living on money from our country. This is the main reason i am able to do this, and dont expect a good payday for a long time. On the other hand, i am ready to spend the hours on the project, support etc. Im usually in front of the computer screen anyway.

    Appretiate the feedback guys. I have a start budget of around $100k for this. Meaning i should be able to run non profit for well over a year. As i stated earlier, i am looking to start in the small, with just 1 node + one in reserve, let that slowly fill and monitor performance closely. When we feel it is closing in on a accepted level of load (or if it turns profit before this), we can deploy another node, and so on. Up-front cost will in other words never be more than 2 tricked out dedis, plus the licenses we need, and ofcourse all the coffee. :)

  • swat4swat4 Member

    From a realistic perspective, looks like the above comments are rational and reflect the truth. However, you only live your life once. If you have prepared, and are equipped with the weapons (money, time, determination etc), why not?

    Just don't lose conscience - if you decide to quit, don't ditch your clients. Give them enough time to back up and offer unused part of payment. Integrity above everything.

    Thanked by 11gservers

    Looking for cure for my desire in collecting idling boxes in exotic locations.

    Don't know what SWAT4 is? check https://swat4-hosting.party out :)

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @VpsFlow said:
    I see you are taking Hetzner cloud in here as a comparison. Two main reasons to pick me instead would be 10gbit, and Ryzen cores, who out performs hetzner cloud easily. Also, personal support with thing you may need help with, who hetzner just replys "hardware and network is fine, read our wiki" and then ignores you.

    • Those who need 10Gbps not so often look for VPS and connection will be shared anyway
    • See nothing special about Ryzens at all; also what happens if Hetzner starts to offer Ryzens in Cloud
    • Hetzner support is quite ok for the price
  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @VpsFlow said:

    @seriesn said: @VpsFlow said: Also, personal support with thing you may need help with, who hetzner just replys "hardware and network is fine, read our wiki" and then ignores you.

    This is where it gets tricky. It is easy when you are small. Once you grow, you will have more users and more tickets. Now you will either need to hire quality staff or you will need to dedicated more time to offer that kind of support.

    With slim profit margin, that becomes the toughest part, as time costs money, quality labor costs money.

    Are you willing to stay up 24/7, sacrifice personal life and sanity to make $50 end of the month?

    I understand your thoughts. To offer 24/7 support on all topics will not be possible, i agree with that. But when it comes to issues with network, nodes etc, we should be able to monitor and respond fairly fast if something happends.

    When it comes to "extra support" who other providers (often) wont give you, we will provide it where we can and help out (just as yourself would do, right?), but it will be in the TOS that we dont have to give it, i believe.

    Time and labour is ofcourse factors here. The fact is that my back got broken a few years back, and because of this im living on money from our country. This is the main reason i am able to do this, and dont expect a good payday for a long time. On the other hand, i am ready to spend the hours on the project, support etc. Im usually in front of the computer screen anyway.

    Appretiate the feedback guys. I have a start budget of around $100k for this. Meaning i should be able to run non profit for well over a year. As i stated earlier, i am looking to start in the small, with just 1 node + one in reserve, let that slowly fill and monitor performance closely. When we feel it is closing in on a accepted level of load (or if it turns profit before this), we can deploy another node, and so on. Up-front cost will in other words never be more than 2 tricked out dedis, plus the licenses we need, and ofcourse all the coffee. :)

    If you got 100k budget, invest and colo. Don't even start with renting :). You will thank me later.

    Thanked by 2thedp lentro
  • sntsnt Member

    http://vpsflow.com?

    If this is u i think better u do as hobby

    Thanked by 1vero
  • verovero Member, Provider

    @seriesn said:
    If you got 100k budget, invest and colo. Don't even start with renting :). You will thank me later.

    Don't know if this is a business secret or something, but you most probably just rent servers at Hetzner?

  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Moderator

    @VpsFlow said:
    I dont really need to make alot of money doing this. As long as each node covers the running costs, plus a little something extra, im fine.

    Until you decide the hassle is not worth it and you quit. I have seen this a bajillion times.

    Eventually you will decide that being woken up every night is not worth the $10/week you're making. It's fun now. It won't be fun on your 100th time dealing with a spammer, DDoS attack, abusive ticketer, hardware problem, node abuser, etc.

    Appretiate the feedback guys. I have a start budget of around $100k for this.

    Lunacy. If you put that in a tax-sheltered, safe investment for 30 years, that's $1.6 million. That's retirement. Or you could buy real estate with that. Or...

    Instead, you're going to piss it away on a hobby host that will be closed inside of 2 years.

    Sorry, bro, but giving you some tough love.

    Thanked by 1kalimov622

    For LET support, please visit the support desk.

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @vero said:

    @seriesn said:
    If you got 100k budget, invest and colo. Don't even start with renting :). You will thank me later.

    Don't know if this is a business secret or something, but you most probably just rent servers at Hetzner?

    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Thanked by 1saibal
  • verovero Member, Provider

    @snt said:
    If this is u i think better u do as hobby

    Not nice.. Should be more delicate with your 100k investment.

  • swat4swat4 Member

    @seriesn said:

    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Looking for cure for my desire in collecting idling boxes in exotic locations.

    Don't know what SWAT4 is? check https://swat4-hosting.party out :)

  • sntsnt Member

    @vero said:

    @snt said:
    If this is u i think better u do as hobby

    Not nice.. Should be more delicate with your 100k investment.

    This guy talking about years of experience with hosting and taking huge step instead of renting out vms over email but is now planning to renting out dedis over email lol

  • verovero Member, Provider
    edited January 5

    @seriesn said:
    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Everybody's gangsta with Hetzner.

  • Ian_Dot_TechIan_Dot_Tech Member, Provider

    @seriesn said:

    @vero said:

    @seriesn said:
    If you got 100k budget, invest and colo. Don't even start with renting :). You will thank me later.

    Don't know if this is a business secret or something, but you most probably just rent servers at Hetzner?

    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Can Uncle Bob show me the ways of this Magic?

    ★ DDoS Protected COLOCATION, DEDICATED SERVERS & KVM VPS ★ Skype: ian.d95 ★ Discord: Ian.D#8515
    ★ www.leveloneservers.com ★ Dallas, TX ★ Dot-Tech LLC AS398395

  • thedpthedp Member

    100k budget for headache and sleepless nights.

    Tech/Hosting & Miscellaneous Domain Names For Sale!

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @snt said:

    Most here can relate with the last bit of that message ;). Not sure my wife can though. But that's a whole different conversation.

  • thedpthedp Member

    @seriesn said:

    @snt said:

    Most here can relate with the last bit of that message ;). Not sure my wife can though. But that's a whole different conversation.

    Tech/Hosting & Miscellaneous Domain Names For Sale!

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @vero said:

    @seriesn said:
    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Everybody's gangsta with Hetzner.

    @Ian_Dot_Tech said:

    @seriesn said:

    @vero said:

    @seriesn said:
    If you got 100k budget, invest and colo. Don't even start with renting :). You will thank me later.

    Don't know if this is a business secret or something, but you most probably just rent servers at Hetzner?

    I use magic. Usually does the job.

    Can Uncle Bob show me the ways of this Magic?

    Here ya go. Secret is out.

    Thanked by 1Ian_Dot_Tech
  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Moderator

    @seriesn said:

    @snt said:

    Most here can relate with the last bit of that message ;). Not sure my wife can though. But that's a whole different conversation.

    Misspelled the same word twice in different ways (there and the title of this thread).

    For LET support, please visit the support desk.

  • seriesnseriesn Member, Top Provider

    @raindog308 said:

    @seriesn said:

    @snt said:

    Most here can relate with the last bit of that message ;). Not sure my wife can though. But that's a whole different conversation.

    Misspelled the same word twice in different ways (there and the title of this thread).

    Can you relate to atleast one though? Asking serious question here sir.

  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Moderator

    @seriesn said:

    Misspelled the same word twice in different ways (there and the title of this thread).

    Can you relate to atleast one though? Asking serious question here sir.

    I think about baseball and it helps.

    For LET support, please visit the support desk.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    The mention of 100k investment and this vulgar message after took us by surprise.. Not so easy to do such things on LET. I think he looks quite promising.

  • sntsnt Member

    @vero said:
    The mention of 100k investment and this vulgar message after took us by surprise.. Not so easy to do such things on LET. I think he looks quite promising.

    Maybe u should work with him and make use of your provider status

    Thanked by 1vero
  • @snt said:

    @vero said:
    The mention of 100k investment and this vulgar message after took us by surprise.. Not so easy to do such things on LET. I think he looks quite promising.

    Maybe u should work with him and make use of your provider status

    Huh, he is a provider? Since when?

    A simple uptime dashboard using UptimeRobot API https://upy.duo.ovh
    Currently using VPS from BuyVM, Gullo's, Hetzner, HostHatch, HostSailor, HostSolutions, InceptionHosting, LetBox, MaxKVM, MrVM, VirMach.

  • verovero Member, Provider

    @snt said:
    Maybe u should work with him and make use of your provider status

    I do - for now access to private provider forum is more than enough. I need to mature a bit (or to degrade) to post offers as there is very specific demand here and to manage to surprise the audience, it is really good idea to hire guys like @VpsFlow

  • May pay attention to long term lease that transfer the ownership of equipment after a certain period of time, and any IT startup funding by your country. Unpleasant to hear, LE* is not a easy place to make money and local customers usually bring the bigger profit.

    Don't give me hope.

  • @VpsFlow

    VPS is an acronym and should be "VPS". " Vps" is dumb.

    Thanked by 1Erisa
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