Hetzner equivalent in the USA
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Hetzner equivalent in the USA

letrocksletrocks Member
edited August 4 in General
  • I was browsing through the Hetzer plan and I also signed up for it to try out the server. They are excellent for the price and network performance. However there is a very high latency and overall bandwidth from the USA.
    From home, I get max ~750KBps when I doing an iperf for 5 minutes. I tried their all 3 location.
    However when I try from different VPSs, I get better speed ranging from 1MBps to 15MBps.

So is there an equivalent service provider, not just in term of cost, but overall features as well?

  • I know DO, Linode, RamNode, Vultr, etc.. SSDNodes is the only one that comes close in pricing but doesn't have the feature set. Also the pricing is for the 3 years pre-pay only.

Any suggestions?

Also do you guys host services on Hetzner even when you live in the different continent?

Is latency and lower overall connectivity worth the hosing in the EU?

I am looking for a VPS plan. $5-$10 range.

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Comments

  • HarambeHarambe Member

    You looking for dedicated or cloud (VPS) plans?

    The latency/connectivity mostly depends on what you're hosting.

    Professional Shoeminer

  • I'd say Nocix and WholesaleInternet in terms of price to "perceived" value. Most provides are enterprise type scale or cost significantly more.

    Thanked by 1letrocks
  • letrocksletrocks Member
    edited August 4

    @Harambe said:
    You looking for dedicated or cloud (VPS) plans?

    The latency/connectivity mostly depends on what you're hosting.

    I am mostly looking for VPS plan for hosting blog, personal git repo, next cloud etc...

  • @daxterfellowes said:
    I'd say Nocix and WholesaleInternet in terms of price to "perceived" value. Most provides are enterprise type scale or cost significantly more.

    Aha.. never heard of them before.. Good information.

  • HarambeHarambe Member

    I'd say DO is probably your closest option in terms of features and pricing. Although not really sure which specific features you need

    Professional Shoeminer

  • Het> @Harambe said:

    I'd say DO is probably your closest option in terms of features and pricing. Although not really sure which specific features you need

    Hetzner offers 4GB machine for under $6. DO is no where near. It cost $20 for that. Other feature like monitoring and snapshots are comparable but not pricing.

  • @letrocks said:
    Het> @Harambe said:

    I'd say DO is probably your closest option in terms of features and pricing. Although not really sure which specific features you need

    Hetzner offers 4GB machine for under $6. DO is no where near. It cost $20 for that. Other feature like monitoring and snapshots are comparable but not pricing.

    You're going to find for larger companies - DO, Vultr, AWS (more expensive) and other enterprise cloud providers are going to be much more expensive than their EU counterpart across the board.

  • williewillie Member
    edited August 4

    The closest 4GB would be OVH in eastern Canada:

    https://www.ovh.com/world/vps/vps-ssd.xml

    Price is hard to beat but there aren't as many features.

    Thanked by 1inthecloudblog
  • @willie said:
    The closest 4GB would be OVH in eastern Canada:

    https://www.ovh.com/world/vps/vps-ssd.xml

    Price is hard to beat but there aren't as many features.

    Good to know. Looks promising.

    However the problem with OVH is there is no hourly pricing. So if I want to take it for a spin to test it for couple of hours, I still end up paying for the entire month.. Worth a shot.. I will keep it on my shortlist.

  • williewillie Member

    They are more expensive by the hour, but scroll down to "sandbox instances":

    https://www.ovh.com/world/public-cloud/instances/prices/

    Thanked by 1letrocks
  • @willie said:
    They are more expensive by the hour, but scroll down to "sandbox instances":

    https://www.ovh.com/world/public-cloud/instances/prices/

    Aha.. at least I can use it for couple of hours for testing before deciding.

  • You're going to find for larger companies - DO, Vultr, AWS (more expensive) and other enterprise cloud providers are going to be much more expensive than their EU counterpart across the board.

    Is there a specific reason for that? I noticed that other EU providers (scaleway, etcc) are reasonably cheaper over USA providers..

  • williewillie Member

    DO, Vultr, AWS are more enterprisey than OVH/Hetzner. Scaleway is not in the same league. The US has a well developed budget server segment that is mostly monthly rather than hourly. Hetzner hourly servers are just a few months old and priced very aggressively. Also I have to wonder how many people really care about high-ram VPS. Can I ask what you want a 4gb one for? I've found a 1gb Buyvm slice adequate for most of my random VPS stuff. If you want to do something long term and computation heavy, dedicated servers are better than any VPS.

  • @willie said:
    DO, Vultr, AWS are more enterprisey than OVH/Hetzner. Scaleway is not in the same league. The US has a well developed budget server segment that is mostly monthly rather than hourly. Hetzner hourly servers are just a few months old and priced very aggressively. Also I have to wonder how many people really care about high-ram VPS. Can I ask what you want a 4gb one for? I've found a 1gb Buyvm slice adequate for most of my random VPS stuff. If you want to do something long term and computation heavy, dedicated servers are better than any VPS.

    I wouldn't agree that hetzner is not as enterprise-ish as DO and vultr. What make you think hetzner is less valuable? Is it that the old offer European locations? Or maybe that they own and run their own datacenter in Germany? I do not know about DO and or vultr having their own datacenter. Their service including support and network is great.

    Thanked by 1iKeyZ
  • BharatBBharatB Member, Provider

    Not sure if we can match hetzner yet but we've been planning to hit that budget specific market in USA for a long time and have acquired good funding to actually make it possible.

    Next week we'll be able to offer these.

    E3-1270 - 16GB - 512GB SSD - [email protected] / 100mbit unmetered - 18 IPv4 - /64 IPv6 for $55

    Thanked by 1pxhaxor

    All I.T needs - https://qovic.com/ | Open Source WHMCS Modules | Skype: qovic.bharat | I also work for DrServer

  • pxhaxorpxhaxor Member

    @BharatB said:
    Not sure if we can match hetzner yet but we've been planning to hit that budget specific market in USA for a long time and have acquired good funding to actually make it possible.

    Next week we'll be able to offer these.

    E3-1270 - 16GB - 512GB SSD - [email protected] / 100mbit unmetered - 18 IPv4 - /64 IPv6 for $55

    Wondering if we can make slight changes based on this setup (too many ipv4 for me). I would be interested

    https://NoFraud.co/ | Proxy - VPN - Fraudulent IPs Detection System

  • BharatBBharatB Member, Provider

    Wondering if we can make slight changes based on this setup (too many ipv4 for me). I would be interested

    Won't make much of a difference :)

    All I.T needs - https://qovic.com/ | Open Source WHMCS Modules | Skype: qovic.bharat | I also work for DrServer

  • pxhaxorpxhaxor Member

    @BharatB said:

    Wondering if we can make slight changes based on this setup (too many ipv4 for me). I would be interested

    Won't make much of a difference :)

    It's gonna be in NY i presume?

    https://NoFraud.co/ | Proxy - VPN - Fraudulent IPs Detection System

  • BharatBBharatB Member, Provider

    @pxhaxor said:

    @BharatB said:

    Wondering if we can make slight changes based on this setup (too many ipv4 for me). I would be interested

    Won't make much of a difference :)

    It's gonna be in NY i presume?

    NY colocrossing, with IPv6

    Thanked by 1pxhaxor

    All I.T needs - https://qovic.com/ | Open Source WHMCS Modules | Skype: qovic.bharat | I also work for DrServer

  • TheLinuxBugTheLinuxBug Member
    edited August 4

    letrocks said: Is there a specific reason for that? I noticed that other EU providers (scaleway, etcc) are reasonably cheaper over USA providers..

    Bandwidth is cheaper in EU hands down because there are more exchanges (IX) and they have more infrastructure in place to allow for that cheaper bandwidth, which the US does not. This is because of all of our greedy telecommunications companies/monopolies/regulations that won't allow small business to run their own fiber without it being extraordinarily expensive (basically it is very cost prohibitive compared to the EU).

    Cheers!

    Thanked by 1willie

    Have an Allwinner H3 device? Want Android? Check out H3Droid! | Lichee Pi Zero - The 6$ SBC | #SYSarm - Get It!
    18+ Years IT Experience in Linux/Windows Hosting and Administration

  • williewillie Member

    TheLinuxBug said: Bandwidth is cheaper in EU hands down

    Very true, but that doesn't explain why renting raw hardware is so much cheaper in EU. Power isn't cheaper afaict, and pure DC space can be cheap either way if you're not fussy about location. Maybe financing works differently there or something?

  • MikeAMikeA Member, Provider
    edited August 4

    @willie said:

    TheLinuxBug said: Bandwidth is cheaper in EU hands down

    Very true, but that doesn't explain why renting raw hardware is so much cheaper in EU. Power isn't cheaper afaict, and pure DC space can be cheap either way if you're not fussy about location. Maybe financing works differently there or something?

    Well, regardless of location a good bank to work with will make anything possible, even Hetzner prices in the U.S. Just nobody has done it probably because of the risk of losses.

    Edit: was kinda referring to dedicated servers that Hetzner offers, VPS is different story. Bandwidth and IPs.

  • you can look at hostbrz with the lowendbox special for specs:
    https://lowendbox.com/blog/hostbrz-vps-shared-reseller-hosting-from-2-year/

    they don't allow full 100% cpu usage (no mining, distributed computing, etc), but otherwise the vps are solid so far.

  • @HowLowCanYouGo said:
    you can look at hostbrz with the lowendbox special for specs:
    https://lowendbox.com/blog/hostbrz-vps-shared-reseller-hosting-from-2-year/

    they don't allow full 100% cpu usage (no mining, distributed computing, etc), but otherwise the vps are solid so far.

    I believe Hetzner is KVM which is what I am looking for. The attached link offerings are OpenVZ.

  • Maybe Hetzner gets special pricing on power too?

    @willie said:

    TheLinuxBug said: Bandwidth is cheaper in EU hands down

    Very true, but that doesn't explain why renting raw hardware is so much cheaper in EU. Power isn't cheaper afaict, and pure DC space can be cheap either way if you're not fussy about location. Maybe financing works differently there or something?

  • eva2000eva2000 Member

    letrocks said: So is there an equivalent service provider, not just in term of cost, but overall features as well?

    Question is what specific features you're looking for ?

    * Centmin Mod Project (HTTP/2 support + ngx_pagespeed + Nginx Lua + Vhost Stats)
    * Centmin Mod LEMP Stack Quick Install Guide
  • I am looking for the Price (no coupon needed), also hourly pricing so I can try it for few hours and then decide, combination of features such as large templates, ease of deployment,

    Other good to have features,
    snapshoting and additional block storage.

  • MridulMridul Member

    @letrocks said:

    • I was browsing through the Hetzer plan and I also signed up for it to try out the server. They are excellent for the price and network performance. However there is a very high latency and overall bandwidth from the USA.
      From home, I get max ~750KBps when I doing an iperf for 5 minutes. I tried their all 3 location.
      However when I try from different VPSs, I get better speed ranging from 1MBps to 15MBps.

    So is there an equivalent service provider, not just in term of cost, but overall features as well?

    • I know DO, Linode, RamNode, Vultr, etc.. SSDNodes is the only one that comes close in pricing but doesn't have the feature set. Also the pricing is for the 3 years pre-pay only.

    Any suggestions?

    Also do you guys host services on Hetzner even when you live in the different continent?

    Is latency and lower overall connectivity worth the hosing in the EU?

    I am looking for a VPS plan. $5-$10 range.

    Have you tried LunaNode ?

    https://www.lunanode.com/pricing

    Hosts I Recommend >> HVH | XiNiX | CloudCone | HostUs | Virtono

  • smalletsmallet Member
    edited August 7

    letrocks said: From home, I get max ~750KBps when I doing an iperf for 5 minutes. I tried their all 3 location.

    Maybe try enabling Google BBR TCP algo on those Hetzner cloud servers. It has given me huge TCP download/upload speed gains (esp. when dealing with more than 50ms latency). Enabling it is very simple. What's the speed limit for your internet connection? Should get you to at least 80% of the speed limit, unless your ISP is artificially limiting cross continent speeds somehow...

    Note: This will improve the upload speed of the host, so iperf (server --> client) will improve and (client --> server) will remain the same. Unless you enable BBR on your local PC too.

    letrocks said: Also do you guys host services on Hetzner even when you live in the different continent?

    Yes, currently using many instances on Hetzner DE. Around 130-150ms latency. Easily maxing out my 45Mbps connection. None of my use cases strictly require low latency, just fast TCP speeds. So they haven't been that big a handicap for me.

    Thanked by 1letrocks
  • @Mridul said:
    Have you tried LunaNode ?

    https://www.lunanode.com/pricing

    No I have not, but their pricing seems way higher than Hetzner.
    e.g Hetzner 2GB RAM instance start at 2.5 euro Vs $14 for the similar machine.
    So not sure how can you even say it is comparable.

  • @smallet said:

    letrocks said: From home, I get max ~750KBps when I doing an iperf for 5 minutes. I tried their all 3 location.

    Maybe try enabling Google BBR TCP algo on those Hetzner cloud servers. It has given me huge TCP download/upload speed gains (esp. when dealing with more than 50ms latency). Enabling it is very simple. What's the speed limit for your internet connection? Should get you to at least 80% of the speed limit, unless your ISP is artificially limiting cross continent speeds somehow...

    Note: This will improve the upload speed of the host, so iperf (server --> client) will improve and (client --> server) will remain the same. Unless you enable BBR on your local PC too.

    letrocks said: Also do you guys host services on Hetzner even when you live in the different continent?

    Yes, currently using many instances on Hetzner DE. Around 130-150ms latency. Easily maxing out my 45Mbps connection. None of my use cases strictly require low latency, just fast TCP speeds. So they haven't been that big a handicap for me.

    Thanks for the information. I enabled BBR on a Debian 9 server and also on Ubuntu 18.04 with kernel 4.9 or higher.
    I also tried a non standard port for the iperf e.g 80 and 443.
    However results are same. Speed from my ISP is absolutely garbage.

    As I indicated before, the speed from the other VPSs in LA, phoenix, Dallas, Buffalo, etc.. gets at least of 10MBps = 60mbps connectivity. In many cases it also crossed over 20MBps.

    So not sure what to make of it. Should I use Hetzner or not to host a public site? Will it be responsive for the US audience?

  • seanhoseanho Member

    @letrocks said:

    @Mridul said:
    Have you tried LunaNode ?

    https://www.lunanode.com/pricing

    No I have not, but their pricing seems way higher than Hetzner.
    e.g Hetzner 2GB RAM instance start at 2.5 euro Vs $14 for the similar machine.
    So not sure how can you even say it is comparable.

    LunaNode's m.2 plan is 2GB for $7/mo; I think it's still good value. They are a solid provider, and if you need any help, @perennate will get you sorted out. There really aren't any hourly providers in NA that can compete with Hetzner on price. If you want cheaper, you may need to forgo the flexibility of going hourly.

    Thanked by 1perennate
  • @seanho said:
    LunaNode's m.2 plan is 2GB for $7/mo; I think it's still good value. They are a solid provider, and if you need any help, @perennate will get you sorted out. There really aren't any hourly providers in NA that can compete with Hetzner on price. If you want cheaper, you may need to forgo the flexibility of going hourly.

    I am ok with monthly pricing as long as I get to play around for couple of hours to test the network from home/work to the server. I don't want to pay a month's fee just to test that hence hourly requirement. I can test it and still pay the provider, seems fair.

  • seanhoseanho Member

    @letrocks said:

    @seanho said:
    LunaNode's m.2 plan is 2GB for $7/mo; I think it's still good value. They are a solid provider, and if you need any help, @perennate will get you sorted out. There really aren't any hourly providers in NA that can compete with Hetzner on price. If you want cheaper, you may need to forgo the flexibility of going hourly.

    I am ok with monthly pricing as long as I get to play around for couple of hours to test the network from home/work to the server. I don't want to pay a month's fee just to test that hence hourly requirement. I can test it and still pay the provider, seems fair.

    I'd recommend you drop them a pre-sales ticket describing what you want to do; I'm sure they can work out a trial period or something for you.

    Same for Ramnode, BuyVM, etc. -- these are not huge faceless corporations, they are quite willing to work out something custom for you.

  • perennateperennate Member, Provider
    edited August 7

    letrocks said: I am ok with monthly pricing as long as I get to play around for couple of hours to test the network from home/work to the server. I don't want to pay a month's fee just to test that hence hourly requirement. I can test it and still pay the provider, seems fair.

    For LunaNode, our service is prepaid so you do need to add at least $10 funds to begin using the service, but we have a flexible refund policy (https://www.lunanode.com/terms section 9), so if you use $0.10 then you can open a ticket and we'll refund the remaining credit ($9.90).

  • williewillie Member
    edited August 7

    letrocks said: Should I use Hetzner or not to host a public site? Will it be responsive for the US audience?

    I haven't tried BBR yet but I've found in general, Hetzner network speed to EU is great, but to US, far slower. I wouldn't try to serve a high traffic site across the ocean either way, without a CDN. Latency is a killer all by itself.

    Hetzner works fine for me as a US user because I'm mostly there for the cheap hardware, and can accept compromises about network speed. I do run a low traffic site from there sometimes, but only because I can live with the limitations.

    I must say if you're running any kind of srs bzns on these servers and saving $5/month makes any difference to you, maybe your revenue model needs rethinking. Most (not all!) of us here are basically running hobby services from personal funds, so nickels and dimes matter. Dealing with the headache of a commercial operation is only worthwhile if it's producing more revenue than we'd get by showing up at a job and collecting a paycheck, and at that point, hosting costs on the level we're discussing here are lost in the noise. Just find the best hosting you can (it will cost more than anything like Hetzner) and pay the money.

    Thanked by 1letrocks
  • msg7086msg7086 Member

    Speed between east coast to hetzner seems OK. I can reach my bandwidth limit (120mbps) within a few seconds. You can actually observe the TCP window size increment during the initial few seconds. The speed may not be stable though, as you can see zigzags on the traffic chart where TCP window size goes up and down.

  • williewillie Member

    I wonder if it varies between Hetzner servers somehow. I'll try some east coast tests. But, I think I've noticed the slowdown even transferring between Hetzner and OVH BHS, despite Hetzner having direct connection to OVH network in EU, and OVH probably using its own network to reach BHS. I can transfer from OVH Roubaix to BHS much faster than Hetzner to BHS.

  • HarambeHarambe Member
    edited August 7

    @willie said: I can transfer from OVH Roubaix to BHS much faster than Hetzner to BHS.

    Wouldn't say it's a huge difference, personally.

    Hetzner -> BHS: (28.3 MB/s)
    GRA -> BHS: (28.6 MB/s)
    RBX -> BHS: (32.5 MB/s)

    Single-thread wget's to a server w/ 500Mbps networking at BHS.

    Thanked by 1inthecloudblog

    Professional Shoeminer

  • I wish Hetzner had a branch in the US. They will sell and make a lot of $$.

  • @yongsiklee said:
    I wish Hetzner had a branch in the US. They will sell and make a lot of $$.

    +1 this. My lord..

    Thanked by 1yongsiklee
  • williewillie Member

    Harambe said: Hetzner -> BHS: (28.3 MB/s)

    I wonder if my server config is messed up, or there's some issue with its DC or something. I get around 3MB/sec. My BHS endpoint is a kimsufi though, so it has a 100 mbit port cap.

  • needavpsneedavps Member
    edited August 8

    @yongsiklee said:
    I wish Hetzner had a branch in the US. They will sell and make a lot of $$.

    +2. Too many dodgy providers in the US even if they supposely existed before 2000 but are really resellers.

  • seanhoseanho Member

    Well, one of the reasons Hetzner can sustain their great pricing is because of their own datacenters. They've also stated they are intentionally growing slowly and not taking on significant angel investment. So I think a DC in the US is probably not likely anytime soon.

    Thanked by 1Yura
  • Get one of the deals from ImpactVPS. Search LET for their last offers, which usually still work. I've had really fast support responses, great speeds, and great coupon pricing.

  • @TimboJones said:
    Get one of the deals from ImpactVPS. Search LET for their last offers, which usually still work. I've had really fast support responses, great speeds, and great coupon pricing.

    nah. there's no net neutrality. safer to just use canada unless you need geographic ips.

  • @needavps said:

    @TimboJones said:
    Get one of the deals from ImpactVPS. Search LET for their last offers, which usually still work. I've had really fast support responses, great speeds, and great coupon pricing.

    nah. there's no net neutrality. safer to just use canada unless you need geographic ips.

    Safe? Wtf are you getting on about? Maybe take a look at the topic and see if your reply makes any sense.

  • williewillie Member

    Hetzner's closest competitor is probably OVH, which is in Canada and the US as well as in the EU. They are much more expensive in the US than in Canada for some reason.

    ImpactVPS is a good VPS host but they're not really comparable to Hetzner or OVH, which are primarily dedicated server providers with huge stocks. There are some budget dedi hosts in the US like WSI, but they are usually out of stock of anything interesting.

    I don't think DC space costs explains the gap between Hetzner and US providers. Otherwise we'd see similar products here, with a premium added for the DC cost differential, but otherwise not too far off for the raw hardware. But that doesn't happen. The hardware in the more interesting Hetzner servers (say the current SX line) costs as much as 1-2 years of monthly hosting fees. US providers have to recover the hw cost much faster, like 3-6 months, so they charge a lot more.

    Example: a 10TB DC HDD add-on for a Hetzner server is 19.5 euro/m. I don't know of any US provider that comes within 2x of that, or even 3x. It's not about DC space or watts, but financing. You can buy that drive at newegg for around 400 USD so Hetzner is taking around 18 months to pay it off. Hosts here are either too thinly stretched, or they're after a high-dollar enterprise market, so they charge a lot more either way.

  • Hetzner_OLHetzner_OL Member, Provider, Top Provider

    I feel a bit guilty for lurking in this thread, but I'm not really authorized to give you all any more information about most of the topics that you've been discussing here. It's nice to know that we'd be well received in the US, though. --Katie, Marketing

  • seanhoseanho Member

    @Hetzner_OL said:
    I feel a bit guilty for lurking in this thread, but I'm not really authorized to give you all any more information about most of the topics that you've been discussing here. It's nice to know that we'd be well received in the US, though. --Katie, Marketing

    If you bring auction dedis and cloud to NA, you'd sweep the market here!

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