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Europe dumps 300,000 UK-owned .EU domains into the Brexit bin
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Europe dumps 300,000 UK-owned .EU domains into the Brexit bin

Not sure if this has posted already, did not see it any recent threads.

_In an official statement Thursday, the European Commission announced it will cancel all 300,000 domains under the .eu top-level domain that have a UK registrant, following Britain's eventual departure from the European Union.

"As of the withdrawal date, undertakings and organizations that are established in the United Kingdom but not in the EU and natural persons who reside in the United Kingdom will no longer be eligible to register .eu domain names," the document states, adding, "or if they are .eu registrants, to renew .eu domain names registered before the withdrawal date."_

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/03/29/eu_dumps_300000_ukowned_domains_into_brexit_bin/

Thanked by 1Tom

Comments

  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Moderator

    domxit? euxit? breuxit?

    So everyone will use a proxy registrant.

    For LET support, please visit the support desk.

  • For the small timers, pick a random address in Europe

    For anything substantial, not too hard to find an EU based address

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider

    Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    Jesus Christ. I'm pro EU, but all this negativity and talking down on the UK will only strength people's resolve over Brexit as they will want to prove themselves.

    Being told you can't or shouldn't do something does not usually dissuade people from doing it. Very often the opposite is true.

    Takeing away 300K domains from Brits is just stupid and vindictive. Maybe it would be okay to restrict NEW registrations, but to refuse renewals? That's wrong IMO.

    Thanked by 1that_guy
  • VPNVPN Member

    Welp. My whole infrastructure revolves around a .eu domain and my step-father has a UK-only registered business with a .eu domain that's used for communication with thousands of customers and suppliers.

    Hi :>

  • kmaskmas Member

    @randvegeta said:
    Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    Jesus Christ. I'm pro EU, but all this negativity and talking down on the UK will only strength people's resolve over Brexit as they will want to prove themselves.

    Being told you can't or shouldn't do something does not usually dissuade people from doing it. Very often the opposite is true.

    Takeing away 300K domains from Brits is just stupid and vindictive. Maybe it would be okay to restrict NEW registrations, but to refuse renewals? That's wrong IMO.

    Well it's not like it's a punishment to them for leaving the EU or whatever. The .eu domains have always been restricted to EU registrants and by choosing to leave the EU, this is just one of the things they have chosen to leave behind.

  • EwokEwok Member

    @kmas said:

    Well it's not like it's a punishment to them for leaving the EU or whatever. The .eu domains have always been restricted to EU registrants and by choosing to leave the EU, this is just one of the things they have chosen to leave behind.

    If we go by that logic no students, workers etc from the EU should be allowed in the UK without applying for visas.

  • donlidonli Member
    edited March 2018

    An example of why using a geopolitically based top-level domain is a bad idea.

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Provider

    Fully expected. I think I mentioned this consequence in the thread before the referendum.

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  • @randvegeta said: Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    It's just a further consequence of a decision that the Brits themselves made. No need to dramatize.

    Thanked by 2M66B southy

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • @Ewok said:

    @kmas said:

    Well it's not like it's a punishment to them for leaving the EU or whatever. The .eu domains have always been restricted to EU registrants and by choosing to leave the EU, this is just one of the things they have chosen to leave behind.

    If we go by that logic no students, workers etc from the EU should be allowed in the UK without applying for visas.

    In principle, that is the logic, but whether this is (will be) the case depends (will depend) on how the UK and the EU decide to regulate this.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • ZerpyZerpy Member

    Lol, brits should not complain, it's their own decision :-D

    Thanked by 1M66B
  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider

    @angstrom said:

    @randvegeta said: Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    It's just a further consequence of a decision that the Brits themselves made. No need to dramatize.

    48% did not make that decision. These 300k domains are not likely belonging to "leavers".

  • rm_rm_ Member
    edited March 2018

    Topkek. We sure it's not 1st april yet?

    Even Soviet Union no longer exists, but .su domains are kept working and you can register new ones.

  • @randvegeta said:

    @angstrom said:

    @randvegeta said: Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    It's just a further consequence of a decision that the Brits themselves made. No need to dramatize.

    48% did not make that decision.

    That's the lovely thing about referendums. Anyway, the majority did.

    These 300k domains are not likely belonging to "leavers".

    I'm afraid that we have no data at all about this.

    If I understand well, those Brits with an .eu domain still have 12 months to come up with an alternative plan. This said, it's hard for me to imagine that this comes as a total surprise to anyone.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • @rm_ said: Even Soviet Union no longer exists, but .su domains are kept working and you can register new ones.

    And your point is? An .eu domain isn't similar in any respect to an .su domain.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider
    edited March 2018

    @angstrom said:

    @randvegeta said:

    @angstrom said:

    @randvegeta said: Lovely. Another way to galvanise the Brits to make them yet even more anti-Europe.

    It's just a further consequence of a decision that the Brits themselves made. No need to dramatize.

    48% did not make that decision.

    That's the lovely thing about referendums. Anyway, the majority did.

    These 300k domains are not likely belonging to "leavers".

    I'm afraid that we have no data at all about this.

    If I understand well, those Brits with an .eu domain still have 12 months to come up with an alternative plan. This said, it's hard for me to imagine that this comes as a total surprise to anyone.

    I suppose it's not a surprise, but then no EU citizen currently residing in the UK should expect to keep any of their current benefits.

    Say good bye to Visa free permission to live and work in the UK. Say good bye to free health care, even if you've paid into National insurance. Say good bye to tax credits, child benefits, housing benefits, or anything else typically enjoyed by UK citizens. And that's not a punishment either. Just a possibile consequence of a majority referendum.

  • @randvegeta said: I suppose it's not a surprise, but then no EU citizen currently residing in the UK should expect to keep any of their current benefits.

    Say good bye to Visa free permission to live and work in the UK. Say good bye to free health care, even if you've paid into National insurance. Say good bye to tax credits, child benefits, housing benefits, or anything else typically enjoyed by UK citizens. And that's not a punishment either. Just a possibile consequence of a majority referendum.

    This is also why the negotiations between the UK and the EU are so difficult/complicated. But yes, life for EU citizens in the UK after Brexit won't be as straightforward as it was before.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • rm_rm_ Member

    angstrom said: And your point is? An .eu domain isn't similar in any respect to an .su domain.

    And you are trolling or being annoying and stupid on purpose? My point is that written policies can be ignored, bent or changed, if it would help avoid inconveniencing actual users in the real world for no good reason. With .su they did not yank it off people who already had their domains, here the EU had every opportunity to do the same, but nope, instead chose to slap them with a big FUCK YOU instead.

  • @rm_ said: angstrom said: And your point is? An .eu domain isn't similar in any respect to an .su domain.

    And you are trolling or being annoying and stupid on purpose?

    Please learn some manners. Why would I be trolling? You didn't explain your point.

    rm_ said: My point is that written policies can be ignored, bent or changed, if it would help avoid inconveniencing actual users in the real world for no good reason. With .su they did not yank it off people who already had their domains, here the EU had every opportunity to do the same, but nope, instead chose to slap them with a big FUCK YOU instead.

    You're having a bad day, I see.

    I still don't see what an .eu domain and an .su domain are supposed to have in common. The Soviet Union ceased to exist; the EU hasn't ceased to exist.

    Thanked by 1Clouvider

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider

    angstrom said: I still don't see what an .eu domain and an .su domain are supposed to have in common. The Soviet Union ceased to exist; the EU hasn't ceased to exist.

    I think the point being that whoever is in charge of the .eu TLD could have made some provisions for existing .eu holders. Taking away domains for existing holders seems petty and vindictive to me. It's not like they have their hands tied. People have real money invested into these domains/brands, that they have built. Seems wrong to just take it away.

    By all means, they can restrict NEW registrations, but to take away existing ones? That's not right, nor fair.

    Thanked by 1rm_
  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Provider

    It’s not vindictive. The original grounds for registration will cease to be, so should the domains.

    No cherry picking.

    Thanked by 2Dylan M66B

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  • rm_rm_ Member

    Clouvider said: It’s not vindictive. The original grounds for registration will cease to be, so should the domains.

    That's why the comparison to .su. In that case the grounds for existence of the entire TLD ceased to be -- but it's still going on. Shows there's nothing insurmountable in amending or postponing to apply written policies (including indefinitely), if the actual users' needs dictate so.

  • angstromangstrom Member
    edited March 2018

    @randvegeta said: angstrom said: I still don't see what an .eu domain and an .su domain are supposed to have in common. The Soviet Union ceased to exist; the EU hasn't ceased to exist.

    I think the point being that whoever is in charge of the .eu TLD could have made some provisions for existing .eu holders. Taking away domains for existing holders seems petty and vindictive to me. It's not like they have their hands tied. People have real money invested into these domains/brands, that they have built. Seems wrong to just take it away.

    By all means, they can restrict NEW registrations, but to take away existing ones? That's not right, nor fair.

    Gosh, you seem pretty sure/confident in those pronouncements ("petty and vindictive", "not right", "not fair").

    Look, many countries impose a residence condition on the corresponding country TLD. Perhaps it's rather this that you should be trying to argue against.

    For example, on my understanding, if an individual or business resides in the UK, then they can get a .uk domain, but if they leave the UK (i.e., no longer have any residence or legal representation there), then they can no longer renew their .uk domain. (This is independent of Brexit.) And many other countries have a similar rule. (Some countries are stricter in how they apply the residence condition than others.)

    It's true that some countries are more liberal about the use of their country domain (e.g., I understand that Russia is), but this doesn't seem to be the rule.

    Following the practice of many countries, the EU is simply applying a residence condition to the .eu domain, and in fact has always applied a residence condition to the .eu domain.

    I don't really see what's "petty and vindictive", "not right", and "not fair" about this policy per se.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Provider

    @rm_ said:

    Clouvider said: It’s not vindictive. The original grounds for registration will cease to be, so should the domains.

    That's why the comparison to .su. In that case the grounds for existence of the entire TLD ceased to be -- but it's still going on. Shows there's nothing insurmountable in amending or postponing to apply written policies (including indefinitely), if the actual users' needs dictate so.

    That's fine, but there's no competition with regards to the .su, i.e. it was simply still left assigned to the original operator upon Soviet Union ceasing to exist. The EU didn't cease to exist, UK chose to exit it, so other current members of the club cannot be classed the same way as the ex members of the club.

    In case of the .EU there are businesses that upon UK's unfortunate exit from the European Union will have a stronger case to use the same .EU domain, I don't see on what grounds one would be looking to keep the .EU domain in this case.

    It's a sad reality but it's one of the many things British people will loose as a result of this decision.

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  • @rm_ said:

    Clouvider said: It’s not vindictive. The original grounds for registration will cease to be, so should the domains.

    That's why the comparison to .su. In that case the grounds for existence of the entire TLD ceased to be -- but it's still going on. Shows there's nothing insurmountable in amending or postponing to apply written policies (including indefinitely), if the actual users' needs dictate so.

    You're comparing apples and oranges. The crucial point is that the Soviet Union ceased to exist, whereas the EU hasn't. What happened or didn't happen to .su domains has no bearing on what happens or doesn't happen to .eu domains.

    Thanked by 1Clouvider

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider
    edited March 2018

    angstrom said: I don't really see what's "petty and vindictive", "not right", and "not fair" about this policy per se.

    Of course this is just my subjective opinion.

    The thing is, they could still apply the rules for NEW registrations. The problem I see is that the people who registered the domains in the first place are in full compliance. To have the domains yanked away with less than a years notice is, in my opinion, unfair.

    Think of it another way. You buy a car. The car is built to comply with whatever regulations there are. Your car is a FINE car, but then the regulations change, and the car you've already bought (perhaps just a few days ago) no longer complies with those regulations. You're out of pocket, and you need another new car!

    What they do in most cases is apply the new regulations to NEW cars. So old cars can still be sold on the 2nd hand market, and used by their owners.

    I think the same could, and should be done for these domains. Let everyone who has a domain already keep their domain, and simply prevent new registrations on the basis that those people no longer qualify. I don't think that's unreasonable.

    In 2014, against EU laws mind you, in Lithuania it was only allowed for Lithuanian citizens to own land. Foreigners could own apartments, but not land. Since that was considered discriminatory, the law changed to ensure all EU citizens could own land in Lithuania too (with the exception of farm land).

    So let's say I am a British citizen, and I own some land in Lithuania (because I bought it when the law changed). And now the UK will be leaving the EU. Am I no longer entitled to the land that I paid for?

    I know domains are not the same as real estate, but it's a slippery slope IMO.

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Provider
    edited March 2018

    randvegeta said: In 2014, against EU laws mind you, in Lithuania it was only allowed for Lithuanian citizens to own land. Foreigners could own apartments, but not land. Since that was considered discriminatory, the law changed to ensure all EU citizens could own land in Lithuania too (with the exception of farm land).

    So let's say I am a British citizen, and I own some land in Lithuania (because I bought it when the law changed). And now the UK will be leaving the EU. Am I no longer entitled to the land that I paid for?

    Yes you are, because to start with law was changed to allow foreign investors to purchase land, not only EU ones :)

    Think of it another way. You buy a car. The car is built to comply with whatever regulations there are. Your car is a FINE car, but then the regulations change, and the car you've already bought (perhaps just a few days ago) no longer complies with those regulations. You're out of pocket, and you need another new car!
    What they do in most cases is apply the new regulations to NEW cars. So old cars can still be sold on the 2nd hand market, and used by their owners.

    Nope. My Prius once was exempt from Congestion Charge fees in Central London as Low Emissions car and then ceased to be at a 2 year worth of notice I believe and I specifically bought it at the time to avoid paying CC.

    France I believe bans diesels from Paris stuff that was compliant before can cease to be compliant.

    I think it's important to remember what the .EU TLD was created for. It was created for the business and residents operating from the European Union. Once the business ceases to operate from the EU, they are no longer entitled to an .EU domain. Same applies when they country ceases to be a part of the EU - they have stopped operating from the .EU. They can certainly open a business in say Germany, start paying taxes there and move their domain to the German entity, nothing stops anyone from doing so. The same as the UK banks looking to keep their EU banking license have to do, and likely the airlines looking to fly over the EU will have to do.

    It's sad however that no one was listening to the 'experts' when the consequences were being mentioned. This was all avoidable. The entire campaign was predominantly based on lies starting from the funds for NHS all the way to the expected economic growth and the 'Brexit dividend'.

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  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider

    Clouvider said: Yes you are, because to start with law was changed to allow foreign investors to purchase land, not only EU ones :)

    Okay, lets talk hypothetically. Would it be fair to take away the land or property away from owners because of a change in 'citizenship'?

    Clouvider said: Nope. My Prius once was exempt from Congestion Charge fees in Central London as Low Emissions car and then ceased to be at a 2 year worth of notice I believe and I specifically bought it at the time to avoid paying CC.

    You had 2 years of notice though. And you were still able to use your car. So it's really not the same thing at all.

    I drive an electric car in Lithuania now, and with that I get free charging, free parking, and I can drive in bus lanes. During rush hour, I just drive straight through the busiest streets in Vilnius, making my journey an hour shorter than people driving an ICE car. Now I bought the car in part because I knew I would get these perks/benefits, but I have no expectation that it will last forever!

    Perhaps if there was a longer notice period, that would be okay. To give businesses plenty of time to update their website addresses and get people used to using an alternative name.

    Clouvider said: They can certainly open a business in say Germany, start paying taxes there and move their domain to the German entity

    I suspect this is the real motivation.

  • AidanAidan Member

    Clouvider said: it's one of the many things British people will loose as a result of this decision.

    This sums it up quite well.

    Thanked by 2Clouvider M66B
  • @randvegeta said: The thing is, they could still apply the rules for NEW registrations. The problem I see is that the people who registered the domains in the first place are in full compliance. To have the domains yanked away with less than a years notice is, in my opinion, unfair.

    It's not really less than a year's notice. And anyone who was interested could have seen it coming.

    Perhaps we can meet somewhere halfway on this. Personally, I would be inclined to say that registrations/renewals of .eu domains should have been permitted until midnight before the day of Brexit. (As far as I'm aware, one can register/renew an .eu domain for at most one year at a time.) This would have given people/businesses some more time for the transition.

    However, I don't agree that old registrations should be allowed to continue just because they're old. I mean, if the possession of an .eu domain is to reliably signal EU residence or legal representation, then if one allowed old registrations to continue forever, the possession of an .eu domain would no longer reliably signal this, which would defeat the original purpose.

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    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Provider

    randvegeta said: Now I bought the car in part because I knew I would get these perks/benefits, but I have no expectation that it will last forever!

    Equally as the .EU registrant at the time, to show their connection with the EU, registrant shouldn't have an expectation that this club perk will last upon their country's exit from the club.

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  • TionTion Member

    @randvegeta said:
    Okay, lets talk hypothetically. Would it be fair to take away the land or property away from owners because of a change in 'citizenship'?

    >

    Terrible comparison since you rent a domain which becomes your posession but never your property.

    Thanked by 1Clouvider

    End of line.

  • I think that one can safely say that the pains of Brexit will be much greater than the non-possibility of renewing around 300 000 .eu domains.

    Thanked by 2Clouvider Aidan

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Top Provider

    sunk, getting a bit to political.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com (Just like LET without the scams)

  • ZerpyZerpy Member

    @AnthonySmith said:
    sunk, getting a bit to political.

    Brexit is all about politics :-) such surprise.

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Top Provider
    edited March 2018

    Zerpy said: Brexit is all about politics :-) such surprise.

    https://www.lowendtalk.com/discussion/137719/lowendtalk-community-rules/p1

    Tired Threads

    These threads are either played out (nothing new to say) or tend to generate more heat than light. Think carefully before wading into them.

    • The ethics of copyright in the digital age, the ethics of torrenting, BLAH BLAH freaking BLAH MAKE IT STOP.
    • Gun control.
    • Political debates, this candidate or party vs. that, etc. We're in different countries, for pity's sake.

    This had a chance to be more about the domain side of things, perhaps it was optimistic to think that could happen, given that this thread has been reported a number of times now, it is sunk, you are welcome to continue, it will not be bumped up though.

    edit: Still interesting either way.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com (Just like LET without the scams)

  • @AnthonySmith said:
    sunk, getting a bit to political.

    Fair enough.

    At least for me, the problem was that the article (in the Register) cited by the OP was needlessly dramatic/hysterical to begin with.

    "Linux will run happily with only 4 MB of RAM, including all of the bells and whistles such as the X Window System, Emacs, and so on." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 32)

  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Top Provider

    angstrom said: Fair enough.

    At least for me, the problem was that the article (in the Register) cited by the OP was needlessly dramatic/hysterical to begin with.

    Yep, I mean its not an aggressively night vs day political thread so it can continue, just for those that are interested it will sink so those that are not do not have to deal with the walls of text :)

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com (Just like LET without the scams)

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Provider
    edited March 2018

    @Tion said:

    @randvegeta said:
    Okay, lets talk hypothetically. Would it be fair to take away the land or property away from owners because of a change in 'citizenship'?

    >

    Terrible comparison since you rent a domain which becomes your posession but never your property.

    Not really. In Hong Kong for example, all land belongs to the government and people just lease it. This despite HK having the most expensive property in the world. Besides, once you have a domain, its not treated as a leased asset, but actually in many cases like property. They are bought and sold, and rights to domains is very much like rights to property.

    In any case, I already said they are NOT the same, but they are not totally dissimilar.

    Edit:
    I forgot to mention that most flats/apartments in the UK are also leaseholds, so again similar.

  • Just become an e-Resident of Estonia and set up a company in Estonia. Job done.

  • I have mixed feelings about this subject but I can understand it from the EU point of view. It's not a big deal though. Just use a trustee service and be done with it.

    Thanked by 2Clouvider angstrom
  • @randvegeta said:
    Takeing away 300K domains from Brits is just stupid and vindictive. Maybe it would be okay to restrict NEW registrations, but to refuse renewals? That's wrong IMO.

    After brexit, brits no longer fit the criteria, just like Japanese or Americans don't fit the criteria now.

    It's not vindictive at all.

  • 404error said: It's not vindictive at all.

    As the article explains, it's not usual practice. TLD eligibility rules change all the time. Normally, when there's a change, people who got in under the old rule can keep their existing domains even if they become ineligible to get new ones.

    #lexit spread the word.

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