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The Incero Experience
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The Incero Experience

CrandolphCrandolph Member
edited March 2018 in Reviews

Step 1) Buy server.

Step 2) Realize it only came with one IP & find out a /30 costs $8. Ok my fault for not paying more attention, I'll buy it even though most dedicated servers come with more than one IP.

Step 3) Realize they don't provide a gateway with these IPs.

Step 4) Realize a /30 costs $18 including gateway. Ask them if they think it's a bit excessive in comparison to competitor pricing of equal quality services with a /30 including a gateway included for free.

Step 5) Service is refunded, server wiped. Didn't even ask. Ok, well, good thing nothing important was on it I guess.

«1

Comments

  • Well they do specifically say in their terms, you cannot buy service from them if you are a member of LET which is why they are specifically banned from here.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com

  • CrandolphCrandolph Member
    edited March 2018

    @AnthonySmith said:
    Well they do specifically say in their terms, you cannot buy service from them if you are a member of LET which is why they are specifically banned from here.

    I'm pretty new here anyways.

    There was no affiliation between the account there and here regardless.

    Also I'm not even sure if that is legally binding.

    If someone had expensive data on the server, and they suspended it for being a member of a seperate forum I'm pretty sure they would still be liable regardless of the terms of service they have. In US anyways.

  • Crandolph said: I'm pretty new here anyways.

    There was no affiliation between the account there and here regardless.

    Also I'm not even sure if that is legally binding.

    If someone had expensive data on the server, and they suspended it for being a member of a seperate forum I'm pretty sure they would still be liable regardless of the terms of service they have. In US anyways.

    Welcome to Incero, where not a single fuck is given about your concerns or theories about what they can do legally, you ask us a question that makes us uncomfortable, we just nuke your data and refund you.

    They are also pretty sure no one will ever be stupid enough to go legal over 30usd.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com

  • CrandolphCrandolph Member
    edited March 2018

    @AnthonySmith said:

    Crandolph said: I'm pretty new here anyways.

    There was no affiliation between the account there and here regardless.

    Also I'm not even sure if that is legally binding.

    If someone had expensive data on the server, and they suspended it for being a member of a seperate forum I'm pretty sure they would still be liable regardless of the terms of service they have. In US anyways.

    Welcome to Incero, where not a single fuck is given about your concerns or theories about what they can do legally, you ask us a question that makes us uncomfortable, we just nuke your data and refund you.

    They are also pretty sure no one will ever be stupid enough to go legal over 30usd.

    No one would, of course.

    It's just blatant shady bullshit.

    Also I asked them if I could upgrade my ram in the future the support said yes, then I was told later on by Gordon my server was under $100 so if I upgraded any part it would automatically lose the discount and go straight to $100, plus the new part cost.

    (All servers under $100 cannot be upgraded without automatically becoming $100 per month -- they all are "discounted")

    What? First of all I got a "$10" discount for signing up, and NO WHERE on the order page did it specifically state I was receiving a $60 discount for my $40 server. Plus I already got this $10 discount first month and a 2.5% discount for using card instead of paypal? Makes no sense.

    It's really shady stuff it seems.

    Although, the tech support guy Ryan was pretty nice.

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  • They are also pretty sure no one will ever be stupid enough to go legal over 30usd.

    Also side note, your forgetting personal vendettas. And you can add damages onto that.

    Small claims is really easy to do, and if you piss the wrong person off they just might want to make your life a bit harder temporarily.

  • They don't care about fair, right, wrong, morals or anything like that.

    They were caught here literally ripping people off through seriously bad business practice a few months ago, frankly if I had been admin then they would have got banned for it back then.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com

  • @AnthonySmith said:
    They don't care about fair, right, wrong, morals or anything like that.

    They were caught here literally ripping people off through seriously bad business practice a few months ago, frankly if I had been admin then they would have got banned for it back then.

    Very true.

    Oh well, guess I'll just stick to company's that don't want to bend me over and [email protected]&k me with no lube.

  • bcacbbcacb Member

    AnthonySmith said: we just nuke your data and refund you.

    That's the incero/speedykvm experience. Good riddance. They'll go under soon.

  • AidanAidan Member

    @bcacb said:

    AnthonySmith said: we just nuke your data and refund you.

    That's the incero/speedykvm experience. Good riddance. They'll go under soon.

    They're actually doing better than ever, but eh...

  • lazytlazyt Member

    @bcacb said:

    [AnthonySmith said]8(/discussion/comment/2694056/#Comment_2694056): we just nuke your data and refund you.

    That's the incero/speedykvm experience. Good riddance. They'll go under soon.

    People have been thinking that for years

    Have I mentioned how much I hate auto correct recently?

  • @lazyt said:

    @bcacb said:

    [AnthonySmith said]8(/discussion/comment/2694056/#Comment_2694056): we just nuke your data and refund you.

    That's the incero/speedykvm experience. Good riddance. They'll go under soon.

    People have been thinking that for years

    Deceptive businesses grow through deceptive practices.

    Non-deceptive businesses grow through non-deceptive practices.

    Both can continue growing, both can also fail.

    There's different ways to grow -- some take the route with morals, some don't.

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  • Awmusic12635Awmusic12635 Member, Provider

    It is pretty simple really. Incero takes the route of efficiency. If early on in the relationship (or before you sign up) they feel that the relationship won't work out they end it before it gets too far.

    While perhaps sometimes it could use a lighter touch, i suspect this saves them a lot of trouble and allows them to better serve the customers they keep. Once you have a relationship with them they are quite willing to help or go out of their way for you.

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  • incero is good, but use someone like QN if you want support.

  • CrandolphCrandolph Member
    edited March 2018

    @Awmusic12635 said:
    It is pretty simple really. Incero takes the route of efficiency. If early on in the relationship (or before you sign up) they feel that the relationship won't work out they end it before it gets too far.

    While perhaps sometimes it could use a lighter touch, i suspect this saves them a lot of trouble and allows them to better serve the customers they keep. Once you have a relationship with them they are quite willing to help or go out of their way for you.

    Eh, wasn't really asking for much. Wasn't even aggressive.

    I was simply asking for a literal explanation why they were more expensive on IPs than direct competitors. I told them if they explained why and it was valid other than just a form of monetization I would buy it, then they refunded & immediately wiped my server. That's way too dramatic.

    They had no idea what type of customer I was.

    Just kind of a dick move doing that. Incero are kind of known for being dicks anyways.

  • bcacbbcacb Member

    Awmusic12635 said: efficiency

    I don't know how anyone can defend them. It's bad business, it's unprofessional and it's adolescent.

  • risharderisharde Member
    edited March 2018

    Even before these issues arose with Incero's TOS, I knew this was not a company I would be interested in doing business with. From this OP, I am sure glad I made that decision a long time ago. I much prefer a company that has customer service first and efficiency second - this might sound like crap to you guys but if they show customer service as a number one priority, I'd bite and stay loyally. If its entirely about the money without understanding customers are human, leave earth altogether. And btw, if I got that right, that's more than 4$ per IP per month? That seems a bit expensive, I hope and assume it's a way of discouraging abuse?

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  • DylanDylan Member

    @bcacb said:

    Awmusic12635 said: efficiency

    I don't know how anyone can defend them. It's bad business, it's unprofessional and it's adolescent.

    I'd go even further and say that anyone who thinks Incero's outright anti-consumer practices are okay is someone I don't want to do business with either. That's pretty telling about their sense of business ethics.

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  • AnthonySmithAnthonySmith Member
    edited March 2018

    @Awmusic12635 said:
    It is pretty simple really. Incero takes the route of efficiency. If early on in the relationship (or before you sign up) they feel that the relationship won't work out they end it before it gets too far.

    While perhaps sometimes it could use a lighter touch, i suspect this saves them a lot of trouble and allows them to better serve the customers they keep. Once you have a relationship with them they are quite willing to help or go out of their way for you.

    I think in some cases you are right they only want high paying customers that know what they are doing, it's kind of the opposite of the burstnet model yet still an extreame and highly irregular stance in this industry.

    The reality in some cases though is that the second anyone comments on how expensive they are they do get treat like a meaningless number, you can't charge a premium for literally no reason and survive long term, I suspect because of the way Gordon is he wants his cake and he wants to eat it, he wants high paying customers only, he does not want to support them.

    This is not efficient for business, this gives you a terrible reputation alienates huge customer bases, gives higher paying customers options for better service elsewhere.

    The ridiculous thing is that he could have just hired 2 x 1st line guys as a filter years ago and this conversation would not be happening, they would probably have a much better reputation and the OP would have not liked his answer but may have still been a customer lining Gordon's pockets.

    This is such an obvious thing to do I can not assume finances are not what they used to be for incero and I believe this self destructive 'look for a reason not to support before anything else' attitude will kill them long term.

    I have worked in many high charging enterprises it is a common culture that develops when you have lazy people that don't like accountability working for you or you are lazy yourself, this 'find a reason the customer is wrong' attitude creeps in and is very hard to get rid of, before you know it people's top priority is finding a reason not to help.

    Then the boundaries get pushed e.g. A customer comments that $8 is expensive for an IP which it absolutely is, they are not softlayer by any stretch of the imagination and I don't even think softlayer charge that much so it is a reasonable comment.

    Rather than having even a canned response that justifies the IP pricing, the customer is treat like they have levied some insult, this better than you attitude comes out and they just wipe the customers server and refund him, this shows absolutely zero customer consideration, literally zero.

    From what I understand from a few sources, Gordon never had to really work for his money so I assume he genuinely does not understand what the value of a paying customer is, there is always a line, his is extream.

    Tl;dr dinosaurs will die.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com

  • hostdarehostdare Member, Provider
    edited March 2018

    I do not know how much he means by high paying customers . When I was with incero ( many years ago ), we have two big servers for hosting where IP not working , when I asked him he blocked me on skype and later eventually we cancelled the servers . After many years, we are happy to pay our other responsive DCs multiple xxxx/month now where customers are not treated shit .

    Incero model of working is , run some cheap plans and hike price midway . When some customers run , fill those places by running those cheap plans again and again . People will fall for again and again , while fanboys will keep praising and liking this business model again and again ( or calling customers reviews as toxic ) !

    I do not have issue either if pricing change is valid . But if you running a promo of 36 usd per year and then price changes to 100 usd after one year suddenly , while they mention your renewal cost as 36 usd .

    funny thing , Next day you see the same 36 usd promo in wht ; while your price is hiked x times for no reasons . If this is not bait and switch and then what is ?

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  • @AnthonySmith To play devils advocate:

    • The pricing is listed right on the sales page where OP bought, including IP pricing and all add-ons https://incero.com/autoservers
    • These are automated launch servers, zero manual intervention (except for probably the initial fraud check). So while I agree the costs are high - you're paying for a set config, as-is and if you require manual intervention (assigning new IP blocks) you agree to pay the premium (again, listed before you buy)
    • Your comments about them not wanting to support customers isn't true in my experience. Support ticket responses are measured in minutes, hardware installation/replacements within the hour of a shipment arriving, etc etc.
    • I'd argue they have one of the best networks (uptime, routing, etc) anywhere near the price range in the US and then add in generous bandwidth allotments

    Now where I'll agree with you is on the price changes and contract shifts. While it may be well within their rights to do so, I don't enjoy the bait & switch pricing. Don't offer it if you can't honor it for more than 1 billing cycle.

    I don't know if I'm on some special list or something, but every interaction I've had with Gordon, Ryan, etc has been friendly and helpful. Over like 3+ years. So I don't know what people are saying in these tickets to get a response like they claim.

    I'd honestly be interested in seeing OPs tickets (which I noticed were conveniently excluded), happy to change my opinion and/or call them out if they're being ridiculously unreasonable or rude.

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  • Harambe said: The pricing is listed right on the sales page where OP bought, including IP pricing and all add-ons https://incero.com/autoservers

    So thats the answer you give him in the ticket, "not fuck you and how dare you ask your server is canned" :)

    Harambe said: These are automated launch servers, zero manual intervention (except for probably the initial fraud check). So while I agree the costs are high - you're paying for a set config, as-is and if you require manual intervention (assigning new IP blocks) you agree to pay the premium (again, listed before you buy)

    Same answer as before.

    Harambe said: Your comments about them not wanting to support customers isn't true in my experience. Support ticket responses are measured in minutes, hardware installation/replacements within the hour of a shipment arriving, etc etc.

    nice one, but you certainly cannot argue that that is the standard for everyone.

    Harambe said: I'd argue they have one of the best networks (uptime, routing, etc) anywhere near the price range in the US and then add in generous bandwidth allotments

    That's great, but if you keep alienating customers you wont be able to afford that for long.

    Anyway, I appreciate the devils advocate side, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

    Unless a customer opens his first ticket with "you fucking trash host, what the fuck do you think you are doing blah blah" or similar, I just don't agree with the 0 chance mentality.

    I am no longer active here, find me at https://talk.lowendspirit.com

  • HarambeHarambe Member
    edited March 2018

    AnthonySmith said: Unless a customer opens his first ticket with "you fucking trash host, what the fuck do you think you are doing blah blah" or similar, I just don't agree with the 0 chance mentality.

    I agree, but I'm not taking word of dude who has barely been here a month, bitches about 300MB/s sequential writes at Hetzner not being NVMe speeds, and praises Nocix (lol) after 60 days, at face value.

    Also I'm not aware of Incero offering any weird network setups, so these comments confuse me...

    Step 3) Realize they don't provide a gateway with these IPs.

    Step 4) Realize a /30 costs $18 including gateway. Ask them if they think it's a bit excessive in comparison to competitor pricing of equal quality services with a /30 including a gateway included for free.

    ...and make me think the ticket about IPs could be a complete shit show.

    AnthonySmith said: Anyway, I appreciate the devils advocate side, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

    Usually is somewhere in between. I'd probably be a bit more empathetic off the bat if I didn't know the complainants posting history and general attitude exhibited here in their first 30 days on LET.

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  • ShazanShazan Provider
    edited March 2018

    In my experience, it is pretty normal for new customers to ask for help and to open a lot of tickets during the first days, as they don't know how things work exactly at the beginning. After a few days, we usually don't hear from them anymore, for months.

    I am not sure if that's because we provide managed services only but I would never wipe a server after a question, even if it is stupid or takes a lot of time to reply, expecially if the customer is new. This pays us back a lot in the long run (we are in the hosting industry since 2001).

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  • AlexBarakovAlexBarakov Member, Provider

    Harambe said: ...and make me think the ticket about IPs could be a complete shit show.

    They can statically route a single IP, through his main IP, to save on IP space for broadcast and gw.

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  • @AlexBarakov said:

    Harambe said: ...and make me think the ticket about IPs could be a complete shit show.

    They can statically route a single IP, through his main IP, to save on IP space for broadcast and gw.

    Looks like they may do that for the autoserver product, I don't have add-ons for mine so I can't confirm but re-reading the line on sales page makes it appear you're correct.

    Additional Static Route IPv4 /30 $8, /29 $10, /28 $20, /27 $30, /26 $50, /25 $70, /24 $140 per month via Sales Ticket

    So all it takes is tweaking the network config on the box to route the new block appropriately, but guessing OP just wanted to just be able to run a bridged config - hence more (manual) work in setup and an added cost from provider?

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  • @maldovia said:
    incero is good, but use someone like QN if you want support.
    @Harambe said:

    AnthonySmith said: Unless a customer opens his first ticket with "you fucking trash host, what the fuck do you think you are doing blah blah" or similar, I just don't agree with the 0 chance mentality.

    I agree, but I'm not taking word of dude who has barely been here a month, bitches about 300MB/s sequential writes at Hetzner not being NVMe speeds, and praises Nocix (lol) after 60 days, at face value.

    Also I'm not aware of Incero offering any weird network setups, so these comments confuse me...

    Step 3) Realize they don't provide a gateway with these IPs.

    Step 4) Realize a /30 costs $18 including gateway. Ask them if they think it's a bit excessive in comparison to competitor pricing of equal quality services with a /30 including a gateway included for free.

    ...and make me think the ticket about IPs could be a complete shit show.

    AnthonySmith said: Anyway, I appreciate the devils advocate side, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

    Usually is somewhere in between. I'd probably be a bit more empathetic off the bat if I didn't know the complainants posting history and general attitude exhibited here in their first 30 days on LET.

    You can leave the thread now Gordon. We all know its you.

  • CrandolphCrandolph Member
    edited March 2018

    Btw this is exactly what was sent before suspension:

    #

    Well, let me ask a question.

    Why is it that your IP pricing is so much more expensive than alternative dedicated server providers?

    Why do you have to pay an additional $18 for 5 total ips, whereas 5 usable ips is normally included for free (example Nocix).

    I'm fine with paying an additional $18 if I know it benefits me somehow, i.e. a more secure local network.

    Can you please explain this?

    Thank you.

  • So, let me ask the other way around: Why in hell should anyone get a dedi or a vps from incero?

    Is there anything positive that sets them apart?

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  • @bsdguy said:
    So, let me ask the other way around: Why in hell should anyone get a dedi or a vps from incero?

    Is there anything positive that sets them apart?

    Eh people say decent network but i get within 10ms worldwide of incero with nocix.

    Then they say theyre stable but were just down for a day.

    /shrug

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  • Incero is a piece of sh***

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