Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!


KVM discussion
New on LowEndTalk? Please Register and read our Community Rules.

All new Registrations are manually reviewed and approved, so a short delay after registration may occur before your account becomes active.

KVM discussion

blackblack Member

So I'm wondering, why do people prefer KVM over other visualization types? It's slower compared to openVZ. Sure everything is virtualized, but why is this necessary? Are you doing some heavy modification of an OS (Custom kernel etc etc)?

I guess what I'm asking is, what are the benefits that you get on KVM that you actually use, that's not available in openVZ?

(P.S. - I'm looking for a KVM to play with, preferably in Texas with about 256 MB of ram / 10 GB HD / 100 GB bandwidth for no more than $15 / year. Feel free to shoot me a PM or post in the thread if you have any suggestions)

«1

Comments

  • trexostrexos Member

    I think windows server user need it, because with openvz it's not possible to virtualize windows :)

  • MikeInMikeIn Member

    I am a N00b though, KVM= Dedicated Resources (Not fully correct), More secure, Separate Kernal, can run almost all OS types and not limited to linux only..
    Easy VNC ;)
    And hope fully many more....

  • blackblack Member

    @trexos said:
    I think windows server user need it, because with openvz it's not possible to virtualize windows :)

    ba dum tssssss

  • MikeInMikeIn Member

    $15 in this case maybe slightly less, but certainly not impossible... Best of luck...

    P.S. I am not a provider :)

  • $15 won't happen, it'll be in the $25 - 30 range.

    See also, Hostigation and BuyVM.

  • blackblack Member

    @doughmanes said:
    $15 won't happen, it'll be in the $25 - 30 range.

    See also, Hostigation and BuyVM.

    I know blueVM offered one for $12 for a limited time
    Torqhost has one for $13 ish

    Both aren't in Texas.

    Liquidhost has one but I don't want to spend $20 on something I might use a few times a month.

  • trexostrexos Member

    wasn't joking. sure it's a known reason but you didn't mention it.

  • blackblack Member

    @trexos said:
    wasn't joking. sure it's a known reason but you didn't mention it.

    Definitely. It's way cheaper to go with KVM than to purchase a windows VPS.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    I used to not prefer it. Taste changes over time it seems. I now prefer KVM for the kernel access. It isn't so much about heavy modification as it is simply the freedom to spin up a kernel module as I please.

  • NeoNeo Banned

    torqhost.com? Its not in USA but only 15Euros per Year.

  • serverianserverian Member
    edited June 2013
    • Ability to use a VPS exactly as a dedicated server. (Except GPU)
    • Ability to install any OS you want. Use ISO to install your operating system and don't need to depend on someone's installation that has unnecessary things that you don't need.
    • Ability to encrypt your file system.
    • Ability to use newer kernels without waiting your host updates them.
    • Ability to use >=3.2 kernel.
    • Ability to run Windows and FreeBSD.
    • Ability to load any kernel modules you want without needing your host's competence.
    • Don't have to worry about others fuck the node's IO or CPU up.
    • Avoiding host's crazy overselling of RAM and therefore disk IO. I.e 100 x 2GB OVZ containers on a 32GB node.
    • Avoiding host's searching through your processes.
    • Avoiding host's looking into your files for abuse inspection. (Can be done in KVM, too, but hosts won't do that unless you are continuously causing lots of trouble)
    • Avoiding potential root escalation kernel exploits.
    • Avoiding sharing the node with too many people. This eliminates the speed of OVZ.
    • Having actual isolation between virtual machines.
    • From provider side, ability to limit IO and CPU for VMs.
    • From provider side, needing to go to the qemu tools to actually manage the VMs, therefore having lots of experience vs having solusvm to hold your hand.

    A question to ask. Why doesn't any Linode level provider use OVZ? They might know better than us..

    Thanked by 2Mark_R geekalot
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited June 2013

    @serverian I'm fairly certain that plenty of large hosts use Virtuozzo. Though I'm not particularly certain that the licensing fee, Windows capability, and support make it less likely to be oversold or even more stable. The simplicity of SolusVM and the "free" state of OpenVZ are the only things that can be blamed for the stereotypes that are associated with OpenVZ on these little forums.

  • @jarland said:
    blamed for the stereotypes that are associated with OpenVZ on these little forums.

    I think that stereotypes are more general than the limits of these little forums. I believe around 80% of people who are into VPSes think KVM/Xen HVM/VMWare VPSes are more stable.

    You are right. The simplicity of SolusVM and having OVZ free makes every men and their dog go into this business without knowing how to manage servers and without having sustainable market plans other than overselling. They are pushed into overselling to compete with the hosts who are overselling but doing it right. And shit hits the fan. The customers read that another host is being deadpoolled or getting lots of complaints about slow performance. So they look into what virtualization the host uses. They see OVZ. So they blame it.

  • @jarland said:
    The simplicity of SolusVM and the "free" state of OpenVZ are the only things that can be blamed for the stereotypes that are associated with OpenVZ on these little forums.

    OVZ, when done right, is beautiful.

    Any virtualization, when done poorly, is a trainwreck.

  • SpiritSpirit Member

    @jarland said:
    The simplicity of SolusVM and the "free" state of OpenVZ are the only things that can be blamed for the stereotypes that are associated with OpenVZ on these little forums.

    I am not so sure about that. It's not so hard to request tun/tap activation with hosts who don't support this with SolusVM however it can be really pita and time demanding when you need to go back and forth with host to load lets say modules for iptables.

  • Add in KVM supports ipsec.

  • LeeLee Veteran
    edited June 2013

    For a few of the reasons Serverian has mentioned but also because most of the inexperienced providers around here and on WHT are basically too stupid to be able to setup a KVM node successfully, so they hide behind OVZ.

    It's a lot easier to spot a good KVM provider than it is an OVZ one.

  • KVM like dedi server for me.
    OVZ - wrong memory calculation.
    Xen - changed kernel.

    Why i choese KVM?

    • I believe I can fly, I believe I can touch the sky
    • I think about it every night and day, spread my wings and fly away
    • I believe I can soar, I see me runnin' through that open door
    • I believe I can fly, I believe I can fly
    • I believe I can fly

    But if you want serious argument here is it:

    • Fully virtualized.
    • Like dedi server.
    • I by myself install NORMAL any disk image of any software what i want.
    • i do not like other virtualization (i tell it before)
  • KVM is better than OpenVZ.

    • You can create a network bridge
    • You can control what kernel options are available
    • There's a multitude of items that can be done in KVM that you can't in OpenVZ.

    Xen HVM can do alot of the same things KVM can do.

  • tuxtux Member

    @trexos said:
    I think windows server user need it, because with openvz it's not possible to virtualize windows :)

    It is possible: http://freevps.us/thread-2789.html

  • EpidriveEpidrive Member
    edited June 2013

    @tux it has to be xen or kvm.

  • PcJamesyPcJamesy Member
    edited June 2013

    Maybe one of the hosts can answer this, why do the LEB kvm offering have relatively low diskspace compaired to openvz. Of course with openvz has overselling, but is the cost of diskspace so much that most providers can only give ~10gb @LEB pricing.

  • RaymiiRaymii Member

    I like KVM because it allows me to do crazy things with own kernels, load FreeBSD, use GlusterFS, Corosync/Pacemaker, experiment with BTRFS, lets me run Mikrotik and IOU, and all of those things OpenVZ doesn't do. But, whenever I need to run a website or web app which doesn't require HA, then OpenVZ is just file.

  • @PcJamesy said:
    Maybe one of the hosts can answer this, why do the LEB kvm offering have relatively low diskspace compaired to openvz. Of course with openvz has overselling, but is the cost of diskspace so much that most providers can only give ~10gb LEB pricing.

    Because once disk space is allocated you can't have it back. In OpenVZ you share it in a pool.

    Say you have 4x1TB in RAID10 = ~1.8TB, try calculate how much disk will be available per VPS that way.

  • rds100rds100 Member

    Actually you can probably create sparse volumes for the KVM machines, which would allow you to "overallocate" the disk space there too.

    The problem is that with OpenVZ you can do optimizations of the filesystem to cause less seeking of the disks, which results in better performance for everyone.
    With KVM everyone has his own file system, usually without optimizations. So there is much higher need for random iops for KVM. If the KVM users were given the same space as the OpenVZ users and they actually use it - this would result in much more seeking / higher load on the disk arrays.

  • @PcJamesy said:
    Maybe one of the hosts can answer this, why do the LEB kvm offering have relatively low diskspace compaired to openvz. Of course with openvz has overselling, but is the cost of diskspace so much that most providers can only give ~10gb LEB pricing.

    Because many LEB providers don't know how to oversell KVM disk space. It's not enabled by default on SolusVM.

  • edited June 2013

    @Rallias said:
    Because many LEB providers don't know how to oversell KVM disk space. It's not enabled by default on SolusVM.

    If your talking about enabling Qcow, then maybe it's best they don't

    Best way to oversell disk on KVM is with shared storage

  • @ShardHost said:
    Best way to oversell disk on KVM is with shared storage

    Well, quite frankly, so long as the overselling is managed (I know, novel idea), I don't see a problem with them. My favorite method involves not Qcow (eew... fucking eew) but thin provisioned LVM. I'm using such a deal with my upcoming LXC panel (I'm doing a separate deal to @BlueVM 's BlueCP).

  • KVM is good for windows vps

  • @ComfortVPS, keep going. Almost 10 posts. You are there!

Sign In or Register to comment.