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Windows VPS for small independent radio station :)
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Windows VPS for small independent radio station :)

TripleFFFTripleFFF Member
edited January 2017 in Requests

Hi! I'm Josh, I'm running a small radio station from my laptop using RadioDJ and LAME, both open source.

I need a Windows 7 solution to be able to run my station remotely. It's a tiny channel, with maybe 20 listeners a month, which is why I can't afford to pay for a big VPS.
Also, the bandwidth is very VERY small, 128kb MP3 stream to a small free Icecast server.

My station is completely unmonetized and plays a lot of unsigned music from small artists around the country and the internet. I'm happy to add sponsorship details onto my website, blog and even dedicate a show to be sponsored by the right agent.

(ethically, I can't sign over airtime rights as the station is about promoting open source and independent artists, and no advertisements run on my channel. However I am open to discussion and negotiation)

I'd like to be able to record shows offline while travelling, and then upload them to the server to play out at dedicated times when I reach a town or wifi point.

Techish specs:
RadioDJ is my favourite automation software and it will run on Win7, 8 or 10 with 1ghz processor and 2G ram (Win7 is recommended)

Rivendell is an alternative automation software. It's TINY and can run on anything practically. It will run on my RaspberryPi, but I'm not used to it yet.

MYSQL Database is about 100mb in size. I set it up using google, and I don't know much about it.

LAME (Lossy Audio Media Encoder) sends a 128kbit stream to a free Icecast server (caster.fm) and from there it plays to my blogspot.

I'm always open to ideas and suggestions, and please feel free to ask me questions!

A bit about me:
I've built a caravan (RV) and I'm travelling through New Zealand running on solar power. I've worked in the radio industry for about 8 years, and I'm a sound engineer for small festivals and bands. I DJ at parties and events, and I just quit my fulltime job to make this happen. It's my life long dream.

Thanks for your time! Please excuse me if this is the wrong board :)

FFF - http://tripleflive.blogspot.co.nz

Thanked by 1Janevski
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Comments

  • MikeAMikeA Member, Patron Provider

    You'll probably have a hard time finding a cheap VPS with Windows, why not try running the app through wine/mono and see if it functions properly on Linux.

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • TripleFFFTripleFFF Member
    edited January 2017

    I've had a good trawl through the [vendor support] forums and gave it a shot on a live disk with no luck.

    There IS a linux system called Rivendell that is my backup plan, and apparently it can even run on RaspberryPi, but RadioDJ is the only system I've tested thoroughly enough to answer questions about.

  • lonealonea Member, Host Rep

    What's your budget ? I think if you up to around $40-50 ish you should be able to get some sort of colocation going. Budget windows vps = low ram = bad performance

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • HannanHannan Member, Host Rep

    How cheap is cheap? Do you have a budget range? With Windows 7. You need at least 1GB of RAM to just run it. I would recommend you to get at least 2GB of RAM or more. Another option is to use Windows Server which uses less memory or older Windows desktop versions.

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • To be honest, this is my first foray into VPS research, and so far all I know about VPS' is that I can't afford one :) $50 US a year would be the top edge of my pocket budget right now, but I hope with stability and uptime I can work a sponsorship model in somewhere.

    I'm open to changing systems as long as I can reliably test first, the last thing I want is to shell out for something that I can't use, or muck people like you guys around while I figure it out

  • @jvnadr @elofty mayhelp.

    Thanked by 2TripleFFF jvnadr
  • I really hope that's not an insulting number. We're only just starting up, but our internet access here in NZ is very unstable, and I'm having a hard time retaining listeners. I was suggested to look into a VPS solution by a friend, so after a quick google trawl and eventually a reddit thread, I wound up here :)

  • you came to the right place, a lot of providers and exports around. give a budget and your on a good start to get offers...

    Thanked by 1PepeSilvia
  • Take a look at BuyVM slices...I think that the cheapest one @3.50/month could probably do what you need it to. It includes a windows license.

    https://buyvm.net/kvm-dedicated-server-slices

    Thanked by 1Hxxx
  • Because my station is so small and mobile, terrestrial advertising is not currently a viable strategy. Online sponsorship and / or affiliation would be awesome, but I'm being cautious not to overstate my capabilities and overextend myself. Our current overheads are zero, so finding a balance between benefit and budget is top priority.

    Once I have learned more about the hosting options available and the costs involved, I can build a more realistic plan for possible scaling. I want to make it clear that I've never done anything like this before, it's scary and exciting! Thanks so much for everyones help, this is happening a lot faster than I anticipated

  • @TripleFFF in addition to BuyVM slices (which may or may not work, depending on how much processing is involved, since you get a 1/4 core), you may want to reach out to @VortexMagnus to see if he can put together a custom plan within your ~$50/year budget. I suspect he can :).

  • I gotz me a little vps for 18 bucks a year. 1 gig a ram, 4tb bandwidth and full root. Itz got the solus/vm panel and I slapped it up with icecast 2.3.3, icess and icegenerator.

    To broadcast I use Butt, Mixxx, radiodj and vlc. I have ices playing some ogg files around the clock and can interrupt the stream and go live from any internet connect as long as its stable. Icegenerator plays mp3 files but not all browsers play mp3 with html5 audio.

    On the radio connect page I run wimpy. The LET provider is Alpharacks and I'm sure there will be attacks from people who don't wanna hear such heretical vps noise.

    For kicks I have a chatroom for the kids to play in while listening to whatever happens to be on. Have a look talkradio.rocks/Player

    So ya, get a vps and do it. Most a this is protected secrets and very few will let the cat out a the bag on how to do this.

    Thanked by 3TripleFFF WSS NANO
  • jvnadrjvnadr Member
    edited January 2017

    @ehab Thanks for the mention.

    Now, on topic:
    @TripleFFF There are some solutions for you.
    I run RadioDJ (for whom does not know it, it's an excellent FREE radio automation software that can be compared to the $$$ costing professional softwares out there. We use it at the local radio station of the Public Radio I work for) locally. I have managed also to have terminals and can remotely control it.
    I have not tried to install it to a windows vps, but I will give a shot this week to see if it can be run and configured correctly (main issue would be audio output).
    But in my opinion, airtime would be the perfect piece of software you need. It is designed for exactly what you described in your OP.
    It will transmit playlists, random playlists, scheduled shows and you can even do live broadcast remotely, just by transmitting (with a password) your stream to airtime server.
    The software can be run on linux within even a small 512 vps (maybe even smaller, I have not pushed that much). So, you can even find a 15-18$ per year vps that can handle it perfectly.

    Grab it from here: https://www.sourcefabric.org/en/airtime/
    It's a little creepy sometimes on installation, but it works like a charm when you have a successful installation. And it has a built it icecast server, media editing, media library capabilities, listener's statistics and much more.

    PS: If you want help, drop me a message!

    Thanked by 2TripleFFF Makenai
  • Thanks so much @leona and @jvnader, wow you guys are fantastic! I've learned more in the last 2 hours than I have all the last year :D

    I'm in love with RadioDJ, and VB-Audio cable works quite well for audio output on my system. I'm diving into the airtime rotations tutorials at the moment and it looks terrifying! I think I can get a handle on it, having trouble with the online demo but a few more youtube tutorials and I reckon I'll have it

  • jvnadrjvnadr Member
    edited January 2017

    UPDATE:

    And, yes, RadioDJ can work on a windows vps!

    @TripleFFF This is a quick config I setup. Installed in Win7 vps with these specs:

    • RadioDJ with MySQL and HeidiSQL for configs.
    • MBrecaster for transmitting to an icecast or a shoutcast server
    • Virtual Cable: A freeware software that creates a virtual sound card, transmitting directly the output of RadioDJ to input of MBRecaster.
    • Mp3 songs!

    I think you know how RadioDJ works. YOu can even setup as terminal your laptop, using openvpn and the static ip of the server.

    Tested and worked!

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • Do you know if it will run on Windows Server? :D I cant find any conclusive tests online. I'm pulling a test image down now, but it's gonna take a few hours

  • TripleFFF said: RadioDJ is my favourite automation software and it will run on Win7, 8 or 10 with 1ghz processor and 2G ram (Win7 is recommended)

    The vps you saw is a 756MB with access to a single core. Small, yes, but RadioDJ works!

    The trickiest part would be to find a commercial hosting company that gives windows 7 cheap vps.

    TripleFFF said: LAME (Lossy Audio Media Encoder) sends a 128kbit stream to a free Icecast server (caster.fm) and from there it plays to my blogspot.

    Try B.U.T.T. (works on linux and windows) and, even better, MBrecaster free edition .
    http://www.mbradio.it/en/mb-recaster/mb-recaster-free
    MBrecaster is excellent radio streaming software, with tons of capabilities and streaming to icecast or shoutcast.

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • jvnadrjvnadr Member
    edited January 2017

    TripleFFF said: Do you know if it will run on Windows Server? :D I cant find any conclusive tests online. I'm pulling a test image down now, but it's gonna take a few hours

    I dunno. I don't have time now to setup a windows server and test it there, but I suppose that radiodj can run fine in windows server 2008 RC2 (it's very close to Win7). I'll try it sometime tomorrow.

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • MikeAMikeA Member, Patron Provider

    I believe Virtual Audio Cable (or whatever it's called) doesn't work properly on Windows Server, if I recall I tried it once a long time ago and it wouldn't create them at all. I may be wrong though.

  • MikeA said: I believe Virtual Audio Cable (or whatever it's called) doesn't work properly on Windows Server, if I recall I tried it once a long time ago and it wouldn't create them at all. I may be wrong though.

    Just installed it and tested it on WinServer 2008 RC2. It works fine!

  • ask for providers they may help you out with a gig of ram and windows VPS

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • hostfavhostfav Member, Host Rep

    We can provide you Windows 7/10 Desktop or Windows 2012/2016 server.
    Please check following link. You can use your own Windows license or you can get license from us.
    https://hostfav.com/vps-kvm.php

    Thanked by 1TripleFFF
  • If UK works for you, you could look into this dedi from @VortexMagnus

    Intel ATOM Dual Core 1.8GHz
    250GB HD / 2GB RAM
    5,000GB Bandwidth
    1IP Addresses
    Maidenhead, UK
    From $60.00/yr

    https://www.vortexnode.com/clients/cart.php?a=add&pid=21

    Thanked by 1VortexMagnus
  • jvnadrjvnadr Member
    edited January 2017

    I would suggest to OP to follow the airtime path. It is built for what he wants, an online automated radio station with access to producers/admins via browser over the web, natively working on linux. It needs a fraction of the resources a solution with windows server/7 needs, it does not need hacks (e.g. installing windows 7 in server environment, something that is not so legal) nor middle solutions like using virtual audio cables in windows or combine 3-4 pieces of software to make it work.
    And, accessing airtime, is much easier (just a web browser as it relies only to a web interface) and does not need rdp/vnc to have access to remote desktop to administrate it. This is even more important, as he travels all over New Zealand with minimum internet resources, so, browsing a web site will take much less bandwidth and traffic than accessing the server via remote desktop.
    Not to mention server costs. OP can setup his radio station on a 15-20$ vps per year.
    Of course, airtime need some time to learn how to use it. But it is worth it...

  • @TripleFFF asked me in pm some basics about how to configure and run airtime. The tutorials on the net are very few and without details. So, I answered him and I thought that the instructions could be posted publicly here, for any who may need it.


    First of all, you have to upload songs or shows (of course!) using the tab "ADD MEDIA".
    Then, you go to tab "LIBRARY" and chose the button "open media builder" (it's on the right).
    You see now two main columns. In the left one, there is the search for songs/shows/blocks etc. and in the right one, is the creation of our playlist or shows.
    You can create 3 different elements to add them later to your airplay.
    1. Playlist (obvious, you chose songs or even pre-recorder shows, if you have uploaded them earlier) and you create a playlist with certain or random order.
    2. Smart Block. This is something like auto dj. You put criteria there and create random blocks of songs.
    3. Webstream. This is for transmitting another live web stream (e.g. a live show from another station).

    Now, you have created some playlists and some smart blocks. Let's go to the next step:

    Go to "CALENDAR" tab. Chose day/week/month view (I prefer the weekly view). Then, press the button "+ show" (it's on the middle-left).
    Create a show (here, we create the show without -for now- any content). Critical tab is "when". This is when it is going to be broadcasted and if it will be a one-off, a weekly repeat or a daily repeat (e.g. daily repeat a show that can be random hip-hop music every morning at 8).
    Add the show. Now, you see it in the calendar view. Left-click on the show and you will see the option panel. Select "add/remove content". Again, you have 2 columns. The left column is for selection of songs, playlists, smart blocks or live content. So, you chose either a playlist or a smart block. In fact, you can add to a show as many as playlist (sorted or randomized) and/or smartblocks as you want, to fill the time slot of the show. It's drag and drop from left to right.

    Repeat it to fulfill your time slots with as many shows as you want. If you want just to have a 24 hour randomized playlist, just create a smart block with all of your songs in random, then a 24 hour show that will be repeated for ever and in that show, add your smart block. That would be enough.

    Last critical tab is "SYSTEM". From there, select "streams". This is where you put your shoutcast/icecast service details. Do the input, check "enabled" and save.

    Voila. You are ready. Select "Schedule play" from the top right. When a show comes to schedule, your radio will transmit.

    Hope I helped with the basics of the airtime usage.

  • I could put together a KVM VPS for you for $50 a year, this would be custom and I can even include a windows server 2008 r2 licence in that for free. PM me if you are interested.

    On the topic of your post, maybe you could look into a cheap RDP for what you need, I doubt there will be anything cheaper than a good RDP but again it's shared.

  • DewlanceVPSDewlanceVPS Member, Patron Provider

    You can purchase Windows VPS from http://dewlance.com/cheap-windows-vps - RadioDJ work on Windows 2008 R2 VPS.

  • GamerTech24GamerTech24 Member
    edited January 2017

    @TripleFFF Since you're located in New Zealand, there are a few providers that I've used around that location that offer Windows VPSs at a decent price.

    https://kgovps.com/ (Auckland, New Zealand)

    http://vpsblocks.com.au/Order.aspx (Melbroune, Australia)

    http://vultr.com/ (Sydney, Australia)

    I would HIGHLY recommend something along the US West Coast (200ms average), or in New Zealand or Australia (under 100ms) or somewhere else in the Asia-Pacific/Oceania region for low ping, for example average ping from NZ to New Jersey or France would be around 300ms in my testing which isn't too ideal.

    The first thing I would evaluate here is location and latency between the server and you, in fact if you're running a KVM VPS in a location pretty far away from NZ you'll most likely notice the lag even when doing simple things like moving your mouse cursor and clicking on buttons.

  • ethancedrik said: The first thing I would evaluate here is location and latency between the server and you, in fact if you're running a KVM VPS in a location pretty far away from NZ you'll most likely notice the lag even when doing simple things like moving your mouse cursor and clicking on buttons.

    Not excactly. If the vps is good, then, the latency is minimal. I live in Greece, most routes to US goes via Germany, France or UK. Ping is over 100ms to several servers of mine in US (central or even West coast) and I often use xrdp, teamviewer and anydesk to virtuam machines on my dedis just fine. I even worked Photoshop and Quarkxpress via remote desktop, on a server with over 200ms latency, with no real problem.
    For just controlling the tasks on configuring a radio automation system, OP won't even notice any delay. The real fact will be his internet connection to his local isp to the world wide web, not the server's distance.
    And, for tasks that are not latency critical (as radio streaming), then, he better go with a server that is having plenty of bandwidth for cheap and 1Gbps port, rather than stick with a NZ overpriced server with a lot of limitations on bandwidth and traffic, due to the high bandwidth costs in the country.
    Kgovps costs for an OpenVZ 768 MB container, no less than $21.00/mo! (Not suitable for windows as it is openvz and low ram. For KVM 2GB, multiply the monthly price)
    Vultr + Windows costs will exceed 30$ per month.
    Vpsblock with just 100GB bandwidth (not suitable for streaming) will cost 30$ per month.

  • New Zealand is a small island located in the outer limits between the Antarctic and Australia. I don't know if dial up or high speed internet is being used there. I will say, getting a little vps for 20 or 30 a year will do the trick. Where, that's up to you.

    In your case, airtime should be exactly what you want installed on a vps. Before doing anything, harden the little vps. Airtime link: https://sourcefabric.booktype.pro/airtime-25-for-broadcasters/preparing-the-server/

    OR!!!!

    You can buy an icecast subscription off ebay for a few bucks a month and hope they don't disappear one day, pay 20 or more for a managed icecast server from an icecast provider, make airtime on a cheap vps.

    It comes down to how much work you want to make for yourself.

    THEN!

    You have to know the bandwidth the provider of the vps allows you, and broadcast at 32, 48, 56, 64 96 or 128kbs. For voice 32 should be ok. The higher the kbs the more bandwidth your show eats. Same with the audio files you will save and upload to the little vps show. Keep the bitrate low to save bandwidth.

    Your 20 listener show bandwidth can be figured by this calculator: https://internet-radio.com/servers/tools/bandwidth/

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